What do we know about Strahd's homeplane?

[Le Noir Faineant]

...
*Self explanatory title*

*Some things crossed my mind enhancing RM4 for the Wilderlands* (Yeah, blasphemy rocks!)



Any info greatly appreciated!

Thank you,



Your Friendly Neighbourhood Dark Knight

Rafael

[Dion of the Fraternity]

Speculation suggests Mystara.

[Le Noir Faineant]

Thank you, Dion.
I personally would support the *Aquaria theory* more... What's currently crossing my mind is the following:

If I quote the FoS FAQ correctly, then a version of Castle Ravenloft still exists on some other plane. Now, from the tons of books and other publications one can get some info about the near environment of the Castle: For example, if we assume that I6/R4 takes place in Ravenloft, we may say that the names and titles of the people buried in Strahd's Crypt tell us some details. (In this case, that there was a dynasty of the vZ that ruled quite a while before Ss fall into the shadows.)

Maybe we could gather here what we know about that place.
- So, for example, I believe that Mordetn was on the same material plane as Castle Ravenloft.
In I10, we find a short descriprion of the vicinity for more adventures.
That's the kind of info I am searching for, because I think it would be fun to create a rough outline for a campaign world based on that. Don't mind me dreaming...

So do you or does anyone else have any other idea?
Any more details very appreciated!

[gszebe]

Hi!

So, as an old-time Greyhawk-fun (not just RL), I think the solution is Oerth. The famous story of the Holy Symbol of Ravenkind and the popularity of Nerull's religion in Barovia are "my evidences", but I should look them up in some reference books for more details.

[Rotipher of the FoS]

It's strongly implied that the von Zarovich home plane was a fairly magic-poor one, as there's general ignorance about monsters (e.g. people called the Tergs "goblins" even though they were human; Strahd had to consult his library to figure out that what he'd become was a "vampire"), magic items seem to have been VERY difficult to create (high priest Kir *died* from the exertion of enchanting the Holy Symbol of Ravenkind, which is hardly an artifact by most game-worlds' standards!), and Strahd (who wasn't a Necromancy-specialist in mortal life) couldn't even scrounge up a measly Charm Person spell with which to bend Tatyana's affection toward himself.

This fact definitely excludes Mystara, Toril, and Eberron from the running, among the the "canon" game-settings which aren't already culturally or thematically unsuitable (e.g. Dark Sun; Ghostwalk). Krynn can also be ruled out, on the grounds that Strahd's spells don't ever seem to have been influenced by the moon(s), and there's no room for Andral (or Erlin [sp?] for that matter; even if you assume both names are Balok versions of known deities' names, there's no sun-deity on Krynn IIRC) in the DL pantheon. This leaves Oerth and Kalamar as the only possible TSR/WotC-endorsed worlds where Barovia *might* have been located originally ... but chances are (and the old TSR-era Kargat as much as admitted this, at past GenCon panel discussions) that the homeworld of the von Zarovich family is one which was *never* published, and deliberately so. Why not...? It's more mysterious that way.

[The Giamarga]

How does the story of the Symbol of Ravenkind tie it to Oerth?

Also i think the prevalence of Nerull worship has just been added with 3E where Nerull has become the core/generic Death god.


I'm thinking Oerth doesn't really fit. At least not the known lands of the Flanaess...

Oh and good point about the magic. Oerth is not a low magic setting. Probably not even medium-magic if such a term exists.

The only published world that fits the theme/athmosphere would probably be Birthright. But he's not from there too.

[Rotipher of the FoS]

Yep, Birthright is likewise ruled out on cosmological grounds (i.e. deities don't fit; Barovia has no Shadow Realm), and also because their themes and cultural "flavors" (Celtic vs. Slavic) are just too inconsistent.

I think it's better that the original Barovia's plane be left up to individual DMs to decide. That means that Gszebe can have it be Oerth, Dion can have it be some magic-poor backwater of Mystara, I can declare that its world-of-origin is yet *another* eerie mystery of the Ravenloft setting, and Desdichado can make up an all-new world that best fits the needs of the campaign in question.

[Le Noir Faineant]

I personally chose the Wilderlands as the campaign setting for old Barovia; in my campaign, Barovia is east if the Valley of the Ancients, and so between the Demon Empire and Blackmoor. *I like the idea of Strahd being just a subordinate of a more powerful demon lord*

However, are there any more known details about Barovia in the published works?

[Rotipher of the FoS]

Remember that Strahd wasn't actually Evil during his mortal life, just increasingly embittered and harsh as a lifetime of warfare made him weary. Up until Sergei's and Tatyana's happiness drove him over the edge with jealousy, he *wasn't* a villain, just a grouchy, unsocial, middle-aged veteran.

If (and it *is* a big "if"; who knows how much of that adventure was the DPs' trickery?) the Grand Conjunction's events in the module-series can be taken as truth, then Material Plane Barovia is currently in the hands of a Lawful Good king and queen. If you're locating it somewhere that's on the border between a demon-ruled realm and a more benign nation, you'll want to place it slightly on the *good* side of the border -- perhaps even making Material-plane Castle Ravenloft a "fortress for the defenders of righteousness", if that's not too cheesy for your tastes! -- with the implication that, if Strahd was once a puppet of a great Evil power IYC, the border of the Demon nation has been pushed back during the last 400 years, placing modern Barovia into Good territory.

[Gonzoron of the FoS]

Isn't there actually more implication that Mordent and Barovia were NOT from the same plane? After all, there's the whole Alchemist Strahd/Vampire Strahd thing, where they're supposed to be alternate reality versions of each other.

[Le Noir Faineant]

Remember that Strahd wasn't actually Evil during his mortal life, just increasingly embittered and harsh as a lifetime of warfare made him weary. Up until Sergei's and Tatyana's happiness drove him over the edge with jealousy, he *wasn't* a villain, just a grouchy, unsocial, middle-aged veteran.

If (and it *is* a big "if"; who knows how much of that adventure was the DPs' trickery?) the Grand Conjunction's events in the module-series can be taken as truth, then Material Plane Barovia is currently in the hands of a Lawful Good king and queen. If you're locating it somewhere that's on the border between a demon-ruled realm and a more benign nation, you'll want to place it slightly on the *good* side of the border -- perhaps even making Material-plane Castle Ravenloft a "fortress for the defenders of righteousness", if that's not too cheesy for your tastes! -- with the implication that, if Strahd was once a puppet of a great Evil power IYC, the border of the Demon nation has been pushed back during the last 400 years, placing modern Barovia into Good territory.

That's great info, Rotipher! Thank you!
*Would even fit into the situation I set the new, bad Barovia in...*
Do you have any more thoughts to share?

[Rotipher of the FoS]

Well, you should know that Andral is still worshipped in Material Plane Barovia, but church policies have evidently changed: in 351 BC, Sergei had to forfeit his theological calling in order to wed, but four hundred years later, the Queen of Barovia is a (married) priestess of Andral.

The bloodline of von Zaroviches still rules modern Material Plane Barovia, with the current ruler being King Barov IV. As Sturm's descendents seem to have wound up in the Land of Mists, my guess is that the royal line can be traced back to a younger brother of Barov I, i.e. an *uncle* of Strahd, Sturm and Sergei.

Note that Strahd's title of "Count" seems to have been an anomoly for the family head: Barov I is clearly identified as the *King* of Barovia, in past products, as is the current Barov IV. My pet theory is that Strahd hero-worshipped his father, during his mortal life, and had always planned to return kingship over Barovia to his dad, after driving out the Tergs. But neither of his parents lived to see their son reclaim the Terg-occupied territory, so instead Strahd re-named the region of the Balinoks -- which was previously just "the Borjian highlands" -- for his recently-deceased sire, and gave himself a lesser title out of posthumous respect. Had he lived out his mortal life instead of making his pact with death, he'd have probably declared himself its king eventually, after he'd had more time to mourn and to consolidate his own political power.

[AdamGarou]

Note that Strahd's title of "Count" seems to have been an anomoly for the family head: Barov I is clearly identified as the *King* of Barovia, in past products, as is the current Barov IV. My pet theory is that Strahd hero-worshipped his father, during his mortal life, and had always planned to return kingship over Barovia to his dad, after driving out the Tergs. But neither of his parents lived to see their son reclaim the Terg-occupied territory, so instead Strahd re-named the region of the Balinoks -- which was previously just "the Borjian highlands" -- for his recently-deceased sire, and gave himself a lesser title out of posthumous respect. Had he lived out his mortal life instead of making his pact with death, he'd have probably declared himself its king eventually, after he'd had more time to mourn and to consolidate his own political power.

I like this idea--and there's precedent (if you can call something that objectively happened later than this event "precedent") with Loht calling himself "Prince of Shadows" rather than assuming the title of "King" out of respect for his father and shame at his own inaction in preventing Arak's death (Gazetteer V).

Although, if I, Strahd is just propaganda, you've got to wonder why he didn't include that little tidbit... unless Strahd was afraid that the masses he was about to rule would interpret it as weakness rather than respecting his love for his father.

[Rotipher of the FoS]

Or he just didn't think it was anyone else's business how he felt about his parents. Indeed, he barely even *mentions* his mother in "I, Strahd" -- this, from a vampire who, in the original I6 module, could potentially be encountered in her crypt in a state of boiling, unbridled rage! -- which to me implies he was fastidiously avoiding the subject.

Incidentally, I have another pet theory about von Zarovich family history you might find interesting: that Sergei didn't actually receive his Bright Blade as an honorarium for his ordination (he never actually got that far in his training), but rather, that he was entrusted by the church to bring it to Barovia -- supreme irony, here -- as a future coronation present for Strahd! After all, Strahd was the general who'd liberated the Balinoks from the minions of a horrific, bloodthirsty deity (Erlin); he was a military man of formidable skill, truly worthy to bear such a powerful blade. Sergei was just a young nobleman bound for the clergy, and he'd already been given his own gift from the church (the "priest's pendant", aka the Holy Symbol of Ravenkind), to boot. Strahd never knew why his younger brother had brought the sunsword to his castle -- Sergei'd meant for its presentation to be a surprise, once his admired elder sibling had gotten over their father's death and was ready to be crowned king -- and by the time Strahd searched through his victim's belongings, weeks after the aborted wedding day, he'd already become a vampire and could regard the weapon only as a threat.

[Le Noir Faineant]

That's amazing info, my friends!
This will be provide a great background for my campaign (which shall end with the PCs conquering Barovia)!

The story seems intersting for me too, as the way you tell it, the plot doesn't soudn like *we took Dracula and altered it a bit anymore*, a fact that may prevent many noobs from enjoying the unique Barovian atmosphere.

One other thought crosses my mind: Do you think that it is possible that two versions of Strahd existed: One good on the pmp, one bad that came to exist in RLs Barovia, maybe Strahds dark side?

-After all, S seems to have been a pretty decent guy...