Yep, 4th Edition is coming out....

[vipera aspis]

wouldn't that be interesting? though i rather do like mordent, lamordia and verbrek forest.

[Pamela]

I'm looking forward to 4e; I never really cottoned on to 3e. The skill system always drove me up the wall as did prestige classes.

As for shrinking Ravenloft- when has that ever stopped anyone here from making up their own version?

[Rotipher of the FoS]

"Corvus Corax loft" would be open for write ups again because they would need alot of work to be done for them to fill all the areas and positions that are not occupied by "keepers" of the realm whose novels had been reprinted; namely a bard wolfwere from forgotten realms, a well known count and his greyhawk based lich enemy. Thats correct. You understand me. "Corvus Corax loft" would be scraping all but three.

As Scholar of Decay is on the reprint list, might one hope there'd still be a corner of "Corvus Corax loft" with a bit of a rodent infestation? If this weren't just a This-Never-Happened-So-You-Didn't-Hear-It-From-Me tale, that is....

[Guardian of Twilight]

I'm looking forward to 4e; I never really cottoned on to 3e. The skill system always drove me up the wall as did prestige classes.

As for shrinking Ravenloft- when has that ever stopped anyone here from making up their own version?

Well put, Lady Llana. Well put indeed.

[alhoon]

A click on either of the links will show the artwork. Ah, but here's a short cut.

http://www.wizarduniverse.com/magazine/ ... fm?popup=1

Well, they said they dropped a popular race between halfling, gnome, half-elf.

In the picture we can see a half elf, and also that the Green dragon looks more like a green-scaled blue dragon!
Also at another pic we can see a halfling cleric.

That means... bye Gnomes. Never liked you anyway.

About 4th Edition: It was about time!

[Cole Deschain]

Ah-HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Hahahaha.

Ha.

*ahem*

Anyhoo.

I shrieked when 3rd Ed. came along.

MANY shrieked when 3.5 came along.

I can't WAIT to see the fallout from this one.

*sigh*

And there was White Wolf's switchover....

Good thing my crabby hoarding tendencies have left me sitting on a PILE of worthwhile material....

[alhoon]

I shrieked when 3rd Ed. came along.

MANY shrieked when 3.5 came along.

I was skeptical when 3rd edition came along... until I saw the PHB and saw that 80% of my home rules were there, and better done that I have made them.
I shrieked when 3.5 came along since I didn't want to buy again the Core books... and I didn't. I still have my 3rd edition books and the SRDs.
I will welcome 4th edition as 3rd edition is overextended. Draconomicon, Races of the dragon, dragon magic... where too next? "Dragon weaponry and heraldry"?

PHB II, complete adventurer, complete arcane, complete mage... where too next? Complete Warlock?

[Jester of the FoS]

They're ending an established Campaign setting at the time of the edition change. So they're likely ending the Forgotten Realms, especially as it's been announced as the new Living campaign replacing Living Greyhawk.

So they're choosing Eberron over the Realms.

No way in heck Ravenloft is seeing republication if the Realms doesn't warrant a new official book.

[Joël of the FoS]

I'm not sure I follow you, David, since they are not abandoning FR: it's in fact the first setting to be republished in 4.0 - see the announcement on page 2 of this thread.

Joël

[Jester of the FoS]

At this point its rumors and contradictions across the board.
Some sites and "releases" say they're cutting back campaign settings while maintaining setting neutrality while others say other worlds will be updated.

But they have announced Living Realms on the RPGA boards so there'll likely be fewer FR products.

If they do update I can see the big names (Realms, Eberron, Greyhawk, Dragonlance) and different worlds (PlaneScape, Dark Sun) coming first. And at one-a-year that might be quite a wait.

However, there's no guarantee they'll ever release all past settings, especially if the put out the inevitable fifth edition in the same length of time.

Of course, if WotC is producing their own versions of established campaign settings they're not likely to look kindly on free fan versions of the same. That would mean bad things for us.

Still too early to tell so I'm waiting for the official word.

[Igor the Henchman]

But they have announced Living Realms on the RPGA boards so there'll likely be fewer FR products.

I don't quite follow. How is the second statement derived from the first?

Right now, I agree, we really know zip about WotC policy regarding new and old settings. And what little tidbits might have been gathered at this point might be subject to change later down the road. Nothing has a guaranteed spot outside the current, all encompassing MAYBE.

However, I'm sure it hasn't slipped past the WotC people that, despite 8 (sometimes more) years of non-support, many of the old setting still have a great meme strength in the minds of their customers. Ravenloft is actually one of the most often remembered settings - see here.

Let's also remember that many of the late 3E supplements have been revealed as having been a sort of "testing ground" for future edition material. And among the latest products, there has been a Ravenloft book. Plus, there's a whole new novel line in the works.

Given that, we might have some reason to hope.

Might.

And even if all of the above is just optimistic baloney from my part, let's be reminded that any worthwhile, voluntary enterprise, like this site, is never accomplished without a good dose of optimism and faith in what the future holds. So let's at least give the new times a look, shall we?

[Jester of the FoS]

A Living Realms campaign would be less Living if the authors had to continually defer to the newest published products. Instead they're leaving some of the development and future of the setting in the hands of the RPGA and, by extension, the players.
This is not something they'd do if they wanted to continue to release official products and metaplot on a regular basis.

And while that link is interesting it's not an accurate reflection, just people who frequent a single message board. It's heavy on the Dark Sun as that community's website is less active and there's a strong presence on the Wizard's board. Meanwhile Dragonlance, easily one of the most popular settings ever, is under-represented because players frequent the non-Gleemax, still quasi-official site of frequented by authors of the line.

Plus, look at the numbers. Ravenloft has half the interest of Dark Sun and Planescape so that would put a possible setting book as far into the future as '12 (assuming Realms, Eberron, Dark Sun and Planescape are also released in order of "popularity").

Plus, for a book to turn a profit there usually has to be 100,000 copies sold (at least) so unless there are two thousand silent Ravenloft fans for each that posted there might be some reluctance to print the setting.

And they've used new books to test new ideas and mechanics so what's coming out of EtCR is the two-page encounter layout that's so darn popular currently.

[HuManBing]

I will welcome 4th edition as 3rd edition is overextended. Draconomicon, Races of the dragon, dragon magic... where too next? "Dragon weaponry and heraldry"?

PHB II, complete adventurer, complete arcane, complete mage... where too next? Complete Warlock?

Actually, that seems to be similar to what happened with 2nd edition. If you look at the Player's Option handbooks for 2nd ed., a lot of the rules for miniature combat from there were eventually amalgamated into the 3.0 and 3.5 PHBs.

I resisted using 3.5's mini combat system for quite some time, as I didn't have any minis. But eventually the miniature prices dropped to reasonable levels and so I bought a bulk order of them, with the final price somewhere at 80 cents a mini.

Then, two months later, they announced 4th edition!

[Igor the Henchman]

Thanks for clarifying the Living Realms argument, Jester. It makes sense to me now.

And while that link is interesting it's not an accurate reflection, just people who frequent a single message board. It's heavy on the Dark Sun as that community's website is less active and there's a strong presence on the Wizard's board. Meanwhile Dragonlance, easily one of the most popular settings ever, is under-represented because players frequent the non-Gleemax, still quasi-official site of frequented by authors of the line.

Of course its not an accurate reflection at all! What that thread does show, though, is that Ravenloft is still talked about. A lot. Remembered, anticipated, griped about, whatever. Frankly, the most worthwhile Ravenloft-related posts I've seen were from a remote few newcomers who complained about having joined D&D too late, regretting having "missed" such a great setting. The setting is remembered vividly as ever, that is my point.

And hell, I voted for Dark Sun as well. Rekindling it under new rules under a new, creative management would be, frankly, the greatest thing ever. In my personal view, settings shouldn't be seen as being "in competition" for WotC attention. If a new version of Ravenloft is released, it shouldn't be at Planescape's expense. It should be because the people doing it were convinced its just the thing the game needs to open new horizons for a new customer base.

Not because it has "that Count guy" in it.

All I'm saying is: Community, we have cause to chin up a little.

Most often, when thinking about Ravenloft's fate these days, I'm reminded of Duke Gundar. Everyone claims its dead and buried, until a quick check unearths an empty coffin and a discarded stake.

[Scipio]

I agree Ravenloft still had a demand. My players damn near begged me to run a RL campaign, including ones who had never gotten to play in the settin but always wanted to.