Questions about Lycanthropes

[Hell_Born]

Firstly; precisely what "breeds" of Lycanthropes are there? You know, like Werewolf, Wererat, Wereraven etcetera.

Secondly; where can the details on these various breeds be found?

Thirdly; which of these breeds would you advise as being suitable for use in Ravenloft and how would you use them?

Fourthly; did Van Richten cover "animalistic shapeshifters" (Wolfweres, Jackelweres etc) in his Guide to Werebeasts?

And this is more off-topic. I recently recalled that the "The Lonesome Road" website had a Lycanthrope called a "Wermustela"- aka a wereweasel or wereweasel-kin. I'm positive that there also exists a Werewolverine (also called a Wereglutton)- if this is so, can you tell me where I can find it? I'm sure it's in a netbook. Also, is there a Wereskunk? If yes, where can I find it, if no, how would you recommend designing one? My gut instinct is to simply take a Weremustela and give it a spell-like ability to use Stinking Cloud.

[Catman Jim]

The WereGlutton is found on page 140 of the Kargatane Netbook, 'The Book of Shadows'.

[Dion of the Fraternity]

Also, is there a Wereskunk? If yes, where can I find it, if no, how would you recommend designing one?

No wereskunk that I know of has been published yet. However, if one were to design a wereskunk, I would refrain from calling it "wereskunk" per se. Maybe a more exotic name for such a creature could be crafted.

And to set them apart from other lycanthropes, how about crafting them in such a way that they have something that other lycanthropes don't have? Maybe only barbarians, or males, or people who don't take a bath, could become wereskunks, or maybe only those with draconic blood could become such creatures.

[CorvusCornix]

Firstly; precisely what "breeds" of Lycanthropes are there? You know, like Werewolf, Wererat, Wereraven etcetera.

According to VRGtWerebeasts, any kind of mammal that also eats flesh on a more or less regular basis can become a Werebeast (or vice versa), although exceptions do exist, like Weresharks. Off the top of my head: Were...: -tigers, -bears, -badgers, -foxes, -rays, -sharks, -bats, -jackals, -ravens, -rats

Secondly; where can the details on these various breeds be found?

Mostly, of course, VRGtWerebeasts, but also the different Gazs, like Gaz III for Wererats (Richemulot), and of course the Denizens of Dread/Darkness.

Thirdly; which of these breeds would you advise as being suitable for use in Ravenloft and how would you use them?

Depends on the situation you want to put them in. Wererats for example are excellent schemers and feel right at home in any large town where you can have them plotting the downfall of mankind, or trying to become caliph in place of the caliph. Werewolves on the other hand for example are more suited for brute force-attacks. These two are also my favorites, so far I don't see why anyone would need to have dozens of evil Lycanthrope-Breeds. All in all, Werebeasts is quite a large topic, maybe you can give us a hint of what kind of scenario you have in mind?

Fourthly; did Van Richten cover "animalistic shapeshifters" (Wolfweres, Jackelweres etc) in his Guide to Werebeasts?

No, only anything you can actually catch Lycanthropy from

[Gonzoron of the FoS]

According to the 3.5e Lycanthrope template, it just has to be "some type of carnivorous or omnivorous creature of the animal type ... any predator, scavenger, or omnivore whose size is within one size category of the base creature’s size"

I think just about all of the breads I've ever heard of have shown up in some ravenloft material somewhere (canon or fan-made). It's all how you use it that matters.

I think Van Richten made a very brief mention of the therianthropes, but he didn't go in depth with them at all. I think the best exploration I've seen of them are the narrulve/wolfweres in Gaz I. They definately have a different, more mythic and refined feel than the rampaging werewolf...

[Rotipher of the FoS]

VRGtWb only mentions the therianthropes in passing, to distinguish them from lycanthropes. Van Richten did speculate that these creatures might descend from werebeast/animal crossbreeding, however.

Frankly, there are far more types of werebeast in Ravenloft than we could ever need, mostly as a legacy from 2E's inflexibility. Monsters' stats in 2E were dictated by type alone, since they didn't gain levels. Making up new ones was the only way the game designers could scale challenges to fit PCs' advancement in experience levels. But now that level advancement can ramp up a werebeast's power, as well as salient abilities and other RL-specific twists to play around with, there are plenty of better options than creating an entire species of new were-whatevers, just so your PCs will have appropriate foes to fight at Character Level _.

IME, it's best to stick to one or two lycanthrope types for campaign arcs in your games -- as already mentioned, wererats and werewolves are usually best for this, the former because they're sneaky and the latter because they're classic -- and save the umpteen other breeds for one-shot foes and surprises. The same goes, IMO, for variants on the classic weretypes, which are also far more diverse than we need. I virtually never use any of the "werewolf upgrades" IMC, myself: if I actually want a specific werewolf-villain to be vulnerable to gold instead of silver, I'd make it a unique maladictive with loup garou stats; otherwise, I'd rather give my players their due payoff for heeding tradition.

The rare exception, of course, would be an adventure in which siccing a lot of different werebeasts on your PCs is, in fact, the whole point. If you should be dropping the adventurers into Horstmann's laboratory-cages or they're mixing it up with platoons of mid-level Kargat, that's when it's "the more, the merrier"....

[Hell_Born]

I thank you all for the patience you've shown me. Unfortunately for me my curiosity on how to "build" a Wereskunk just wouldn't leave me, so below are my thoughts and ramblings on the idea. Please don't hate me for doing this.

Recipe for Wereskunk:
Take base stats from Weremustela (see: The Lonesome Road) and add the following traits-
Weapon Vulnerability; a weapon incorporating pearls (say, 100GP worth per HD of the Wereskunk) can damage the Lycanthrope as though it were magical/silver- as pearls are a symbol of purity, and the Wereskunk is symbolically foul and tainted (as evidenced by its fetid stench).

-2 Racial Penalty to any Vision-related skill checks (Spot etc). The Wereskunk shares the poor vision of its animal counterpart.

The Wereskunk simply cannot abide strong, sweet scents. Exposure to a concentrated dose of such a thing (being sprayed with perfume, or drenched in rosewater for example) has the same effect on a Wereskunk as its Musk Spray has on other creatures.

A Wereskunk has the Musk Spray special attack (detailed below) in Animal and (possibly?) Hybrid forms. It can use this attack 1+Con bonus times per day. A Wereskunk is immune to the stench of its own Musk Spray.

Special Attacks: Musk Spray
The creature has scent glands similar to those of a giant skunk and can thus spray a vile oily musk in defense. This spray fills an area 10’ wide, 10’ high and 30’ long, and causes blindness for 2d6 rounds (Fortitude save, DC 19) and nausea for 2d6 rounds (-1d6 Str and Dex, Fortitude save DC 19).

Well? Be honest- exactly how rancid a piece of work is it?

[NeoTiamat]

Looks decent enough. Some change I'd make:

Lower the speed and dexterity of the skunk. The mink is a fairly agile predator, while the skunk is omnivorous and get's more of it's food from digging into dens of rodents and the like. You may want to lower the bite damage.

By the same token, increase the claw damage significantly. Skunks are burrowers, and have rather long front claws for digging. If you translate thtat into a lycanthrope hybrid form, a skunk could easily have 9-12 inch long front claws. (Another lycanthrope who is underestimated? Giant Anteaters. They naturally have like six inch claws, I think. Lycanthropic version? Who needs short swords).

Musk Spray. I'd increase the DC a good bit. There is not a single predator except for the Great Horned Owl (who has a non-existent sense of smell), that is willing to attack a skunk. Up the DC by 3-6 points, but reduce the number of uses to 1+con mod/week.

Perhaps post the full stats up?

[Gemathustra]

I strongly recommend against were-anteaters, given as how they DO NOT HAVE ANY TEETH WHAT SO EVER.
I recommend weremegatheriums, instead.

[Rotipher of the FoS]

One quirk you might consider adding to the wereskunk is to make its strain of lycanthropy particularly contagious, increasing the base DC to avoid catching the dread disease. Skunks IRL can be a major vector for rabies, distemper, and other pathogens of small carnivores. This would partially offset the lower bite damage.

I wouldn't increase the claw damage on the basis that skunks dig a lot. Claws suited for digging aren't necessarily also suited for fighting (too dull), and a skunk isn't particularly equipped for combat, since it seldom needs to fight off predators.

Skunks, like many mustelids, show sexual dimorphism to a remarkable degree (males more than twice as heavy as females). You might think about giving wereskunks a higher Strength if male, and a higher Dex if female, just for variety.

[NeoTiamat]

I strongly recommend against were-anteaters, given as how they DO NOT HAVE ANY TEETH WHAT SO EVER.
I recommend weremegatheriums, instead.

Well, nothing's perfect.

I think the claws should be more dangerous. WHen all is said and done, Lycanthropy tends to make any aspect of the creature much more violent and dangerous. Wolves don't really use their claws very much, but a werewolf has quite lengthy claws. Plus most other burrower animals (like aforementioned Giant Anteater) use their claws for defense as well. Although since no one in his right mind would attack a skunk, that may not be the case.

In the end though, DM's call.

As a possibility, you may want to make lycanthropy contagious via the Musk Spray. Just a thought though.

[Note to self: Come up with a Were-Anteater]

[Hell_Born]

Whoa, a lot more positive feedback than I thought I'd get...

I don't think I can post the base stats, since the Weremustela is hosted on the Lonesome Road website and all, but if you say otherwise I'll post it. Anyway, what would you recommend for the Wereskunk's base speed, bite attack damage and claw attack damage? I agree with you on Musk Spray- up DC by +6 but make it so many times per week. It takes about 15 days for the real thing to replenish its glands after all... Also, I like the gender-based stat bonus- suggest a bonus to increase by?

Also, I was originally thinking of making Wereskunks True (the Weremustela equivalent of Calibans) and/or Maledictive only. And spreading the contagion via the Musk Spray? Nah- stick to fangs and claws. Also, why not simply give it the ability to spread mundane diseases with its bite attack in addition to lycanthropy, rather than simply increasing the chance of infection?

Any ideas on how to make a Wereskunk more Gothic then? More suited to Ravenloft? I tried, with the pearl vulnerability (what do you think of that anyway?) and the repulsed by good scents salient weakness, but I admit that creation is not my strongest point.

[Rotipher of the FoS]

I agree with you on Musk Spray- up DC by +6 but make it so many times per week. It takes about 15 days for the real thing to replenish its glands after all...

Why not rule that it "recharges" its musk glands each time it transforms from human to hybrid/animal forms? The glands are being created anew each time, after all, and it'd be memorable to fight a werebeast that takes on its human form for a round or two, then reverts to bestial shapes and starts spraying again.

[Gonzoron of the FoS]

Any ideas on how to make a Wereskunk more Gothic then? More suited to Ravenloft?

The problem is that no matter what you do, skunks are funny.

You're going to have trouble getting players to accept a wereskunk without cracking jokes. I mean, it's hard enough with werebadgers, and badgers are tough little bastards. But sadly, badgers are also funny. See:
http://www.holylemon.com/badgerbadger.html
Even wererats can get a chuckle sometimes.

I can't really offer much advice here. It's a valiant effort, and the stats seem fine, but stylistically, I could see it in a high-fantasy or humorous campaign, but not in Ravenloft. I'm not saying you can't do it. As I said above, it's all how you use it. And if you manage to do it, kudos. But it will be really really tough.

I find it much easier to make players scared of lycanthropes that they'd be scared of in animal form in real life, and even then when you stray too far from the stereotypical werewolf, you sometimes appear to be stretching. ("Werecrocodile? you're kidding right?" "Would you want to fight a croc?" "No, but still... a were-croc???")

[NeoTiamat]

Sadly, Gonzaron has a point.

If you want to make a Were-Skunk, be my guest. But I doubt you can make it scary (funny, yes, scary, no). Same for my theoretical Were-anteater. No way you can make a face like that scary.

In truth, even some of the regular RL lycans suffer from the non-scariness factor. Werebadgers? (Well, they get a bit of their own back with Azrael, who is a cool character). Wereravens? No.... Wererays? WHO thought that was a good idea?!?!

Plus, some animals might be bloody creepy normally, but don't make all that good lycanthropes. Weresharks being a prime example. There is nothing, absolutely nothing more dangerous then a shark in it's natural habitat. It makes pretty much every other predator larger then a spider look like a slacker. Relentless, massive, three rows of teeth? There's a reason Jaws was a top-grosser. But thing about it? A Were-shark? Sahuagin fill the shark-man niche rather nicely, and the description of a human-looking wereshark is borderline ridiculous (bald head, goggle eyes).

Or take the Wereglutton (Were-wolverine) that showed up in one of the netbooks (I forget which of the 25+ it was). A wolverine is an extraordinarily dangerous animal. It weighs about 55 lbs, but has been known to kill a moose, which is a tad larger then it. They've been filmed stealing kills from wolf packs and from polar bears, who'd rather go hunt down another seal then tangle with a wolverine. They're extraordinarilly strong, and ferocious beyond belief.

But the wereglutton is rather funny critter, no two ways about it.

Morale of the Story? Stick to scary creatures, and those that would look imposing in a man-beast form. (Strange, I always though Were-crocs moderatly intimidating.)