The Hallow(modified Grimm)

[Bryan1108]

I took a look at Grimm the other day. For those who don't know, Grimm is a d20 game that allows the players to take on the role of children with a group of new classes (Nerd, Bully, Jock, etc, you get the idea). The players are then abducted to the Grimm Lands. A land of dark fairy tales ruled over by Humpty Dumpty, the Cracked King.
One pretty cool thing is that the characters have imagination points that are renewed whenever they get 6 hours of sleep. The points can be spent on any number of in game effects and is largely left to the DM's discresion.
Overall, I liked this game but the makers worked way too hard to make the Grimm Lands a dark and twisted place (vampiric Little Red Riding Hood, indeed!)
Anyway, I was flipping through it and my girl was watching "Nightmare Before Chrismas" in the other room and you can probably guess where this is going.
Okay, so, The Hallow keeps the same new classes as Grimm but the characters are aged up into their teens. Anywhere from 13 to 18.
The storyline states that the players are going home from a Halloween party and/or dance when they are engulfed by a sudden mist (Man, I am such a genius. Where do I get this stuff?)
When the mist clears, the characters find themselves in a dark land with a tech/culture level of roughly 1800 AD.
The characters are still in their costumes. They still get imagination points but the points can only be spent in effects that are linked to the costumes:
Witches fly on broomstick.
Superhero gets a boost to strength.
Angels wings work.
Etc.
The Hallow is ruled over by Jack O'Lantern, the Pumpkin King. My thought is that he is the original Jack and the Hallow is where he ended up after wandering the world for so long.
The Hallow is also populated by all of the creatures of Halloween and horror in general with Dracula probably being a close second in power to Jack.
Anyway, that is the general idea behind the game I am making. Just thought I'd put it here and see what people thought.

[Desertrising]

I got to say I really like this idea. I think however that making Jack-O-Lantern the ruler of the realm so to speak is a little.. Contrite? However I don't think I would complain all that much if you kept it that way either. I hope you follow up on this idea some, as I am sure it would be worth several nights of gaming fun if not more.

Well my two cents.

[Bryan1108]

Acually, I kind of agree.
Originally I wanted Jack to be there but to have some cool neutral position like the Cheshire Cat in "Alice in Wonderland"
The thing is that I want a main villain. Basically, I think that the way home is to kill this main villain. The only other option I could think of was Dracula and that seemed even more obvious (and done to death, to boot)

[Lord_Pruitt]

Since Grimm is based on fairy tales, why not pick an evil character from Grimm's Tales, or Aseop's Fables, or any of the other fairy tale books.

Or, since your doing a big Halloween theme, perhaps a bad guy from one of the classic horror/halloween movies? Some wierd guy wearing a mask, carrying a machette?

[ScS of the Fraternity]

Great idea Bryan.

How would you incorporate "Trick or Treats" in the game?

[Bryan1108]

I like Lord Pruitt's idea.
We could shift Jack (who I do want to keep around) into a more neutral position. I noted that the Cheshire Cat would be a good model for his role. I think that looking at "the Labrynth" 's Goblin King may also be a good source for him.
The object of the game could be a Michael Meyers/ Jason Voorhees type. An unstoppable killing machine that the players have to defeat to get out of the Hallow.
You'd have to defeat a force of nature rather than a mischievious imp.
As far as Trick or Treating goes, I really have no idea. I hadn't thought of it, to be honest. Let me stew on that and if anyone has any ideas, please speak right up.
So far, all I really have is the core concept for the characters and monsters. I believe that there are not as many "random nameless" monsters in the Hallow. Most monsters are fairly unique to my mind.
Rather than a bunch of succubi, there is Lilitu the Succubus.
There would be more than one vampire but it would be one Master Vampire (probably Dracula) and his spawn. Many zombies and one Zombie Lord.
One tribe of goblins, one court of fairies and so forth.
I also am just starting to get a handle on the geography. For some reason I can't get the image of an Obsidion Desert of black sand out of my head with a dark pyramid in it.
Oh, and every night is a Dark and Stormy Night except when the clouds part to allow glimpses of the Full Moon (which is also every night)
Anyone with ideas, by all means, speak up.
I could do this myself but I am a firm believer that a group effort makes for a better result.

Do you guys think that this would make a good netbook for Fraternity's library or am I getting way ahead of myself?

PS- It has been brought to my attention that the proper spelling for the setting would be the Hallowe, as in Hallowe'en. Thanks.

[Jasper]

I would make Jack a sort of puppet king being controlled by the embodyment of Samhain celtic god of the dead and whos festival became the holloween we currently know (note that Samhain wasn't a real god and was a western creation to associate a god to the festival. But in Grimm belief can be a very powerfull thing.)

I see him as huge mass of shadows and earth with gnarled tree branches for hands and a large horned skull for a head. Kind like this image but less cartoony-

http://www.firstanimationart.com/images ... ran_hk.jpg


As for the treats I would have them be used to distract and appease monsters for a short time.

[Desertrising]

I do like the idea of shifting Jack to a more nuetral guide like position within the game. I mean a group of teenagers suddenly in a land of horror who's only clue is Jack is just kind of kewl.

As far as making it a netbook I think we should see how this turns out first then take that step. However if done right I think it would be a great addition. But then again I am not a member of the fraternity so I really don't know how they feel.

As far as the head bad guy goes, maybe breaking the realm into sub realms where certain holloween icons have lordship over them would be kind of neat with a main bad guy who is lord of the whole place? I really see the Jason Vorhees/ Micheal Myers guy as more of an assistant and way to drive the characters onward more than the guy to beat.

However I am currently at a loss as to who or what the main baddie should be, again however I am thinking an iconic halloween thing, like perhaps the wicker man, or an evil spirit of some kind.

I will give it some more thought however as this project does have my interest.

[Bryan1108]

Actually Jasper, that is a common mistake.
Samhain was not the Celtic God of the Dead. The Celtic God of the Dead was actually named Donn.
Samhain was a month in the Celtic Calendar (equivilant to November I think) and the first three days of that month was a festival to the dead.
However, what if over the centuries, the festival of Samhain/ Hallowe'en and other simular festivals developed a spirit of their own.
Samhain could have come into existance as the manifestation of such a spirit. All of the ritual, celebration, fear and so forth could have produced alot of "spiritual energy" and brought such a being onto existance.
I don't really see Jack as a puppet king though. More of a Court Jester really. Maybe that is why he helps the heroes. Perhaps watching the characters struggle and fight is amusing to Samhain.
I think that Desertrising makes sense when he talks about several minor lords. If nothing else, the Hallowe could use some organization.
This may seem kind of "video game"ish of me but what if getting out of the Hallowe was more complex than defeating any one entity (whichever one we eventually decide on)
What if, in the Castle of Samhain, in the center of the realm, there is a large metal door. This door requires 13 keys to open it. The 13 keys are held by several monsters throughout the land. Monsters that are archtypes that Halloween in built on in the modern day.
Off the top of my head:
1. Dracula
2. Frankenstein's Monster
3. Jason Voorhees/ Michael Meyers type
4. Some type of archtypal Devil
5. Mummy
6. Invisible Man
7. Pirate King
8. Creature From the Black Lagoon
9. Zombie Lord
10. Some kind of powerful Ghost
11. Phantom of the Opera
12. Freddy Kruger type
13. Witch

One final thought to this post.
The Hallowe is a pocket dimension all it's owm. There are no other planets in it.
Since the War of the Worlds was published in the late 19th century, aliens have been an important part of horror.
I was thinking of having the moon inhabited by aliens combining elements of HG Wells and 50's style Martians. Maybe even giving them one of the 13 keys.
I have been going back and forth about it for a few hours now.

[Desertrising]

I do agree the thirteen keys does seem a bit on the video gameish side, however I don't think that is a huge problem. The only real problem I see with making it that large is how long it would take to play through it all. I personally love long and involved campaigns however do other people?

I also feel that much like in video games that each of the thirteen keylords should grow tougher as the teenagers confront them, which would also be a great reason to have jack in the role of jester/helper to the party.

I love the idea of Samhain becoming an actual spiritual entity, that gives a reason for the pocket demension to come into existence. It is a place that exists because of the fear of everyday people perhaps?

I am not sold on the martian idea. While I really like it, and yes aliens have become part of modern horror myth, however I do not see them blending well with a gothic fantasy archetype. But I have been wrong before.

I don't know I am really starting to like this idea, I think it could turn out real great.

[Bryan1108]

I know what you mean, Desertrising. I keep going back and forth on the issue of the Moon people. One moment I think that they'd be great, the next I think that they'd kill the mood of the setting.
Like you, I have a love of longer epic sized campaigns.
I think that the best thing to do about the length of the campaign is to enter it with the full thirteen keys story line and then leave in ways to edit the campaign if a DM thinks that his group would prefer a shorter game.
Maybe there are only three keys or one. Maybe the portal doesn't require any keys, you just have to make it through the castle and past Samhain.
I do think that some of the keylords should be tougher than others but I want to avoid making the progression too clean or obvious.
While taking on the Phantom of the Opera or the Pirate King should clearly be easier than facing the Devil, we don't want to lead the characters through the game step by step.
Still, Jack should be a good tool to point the characters to more survivable keylords.
The setting could have been created from the latent fears of humanity. It makes sense that as Samhain manifested, he would want a domain of his own. It might also be interesting to explore the deep connection between Samhain and the Hallowe.
There was an old British myth that "The king is the land" linking the two together. If the king was twisted and evil then the land became dark and dangerous. If he was wise and good, the land would thrive.
That could very easily apply here.

[Desertrising]

I agree, drawing up the full campaign with the thirteen keys is a great way to go and if people want a shorter journey into the Hollowe then they can trim it down however they wish.

I also agree that avoiding making a clean and obvious progression is a good move, sometimes in real life we get in over our heads so why shouldn't that be true in the game as well.

I like the "king is the land" idea, perhaps Smahain is cursed and if the characters release him from the curse the land will change to a better place? Not sure have to kick this idea around some.

So a few questions to think about.

How big is the Hallowe? To fit thirteen bad guys in that each have thier own area would require a fairly large thing. Or perhaps a small area could work and the area of control of the thirteen hallow lords (or a better name) are small reflections of them, a small pond with a ship for the pirate king, a castle for dracula, a small hut in the woods for the witch etc.

what if any classes are we going to have? If we go with the teenagers getting sucked into the hallowe on halloween then do we have classes like the prep, the jock, the nerd, the beauty queen etc? or do we default to other d20 classes?

What will the characters have to fight things? It seems that a group of teenagers out on halloween wouldn't be carrying around a bunch of weapons. I am thinking perhaps some kind of inate magical or psionic skill based off of imagination or something?

Of course maybe the bad guys don't need destroyed, maybe they just need to outsmarted? This would be a less standard way of designing any adventure but could create some interesting possibilities.

Anyway just some stuff to chew on.

[Jasper]

For those who don't want to have the PC fight all 13 keylords you could have each lord have an item that can be obtained that would greatly help the PCs fight Samhain.

Dracula- A cloak that allows the PC to change into wolf/bat/mist

Frankenstein's Monster- A reguvinator that brings a dead PC back but slightly tainted each time.

Jason Voorhees/ Michael Meyers type- Either a mask that causes fear in all who see it or a knife that can kill in one stab X/times per day

Some type of archtypal Devil- The pitchfork that can summon helper imps
Mummy- Anhk of life that can heal wounds/work as a holy symbol

Invisible Man- Invisablity formula

Pirate King- The Pirates ghost ship that can take the PCs to any other domain

Creature From the Black Lagoon- ????

Zombie Lord- ????

Some kind of powerful Ghost- A ghosly blade that can attack imcomporial creatures

Phantom of the Opera- A mask that can disguise yourself as a native of the hallowe and not be attacked

Freddy Kruger type- Freddy's claw allows travel to any place in the hallowe via a persons dream

Witch- Spellbook

[order99]

It would be...interesting...if somebody in the Dracula costume had to face the Lord of the Undead,hmmm?

Hey wait-idea here...
Care to inject a little classic Ravenloft Gothic into the works? Match the number of Big Bads to the number of PC's. Match them to whatever costume the PC is wearing, and the Powers to boot...if you want more Keys than there are PC's, have them in the hands of Lesser Evils(or Lesser Goods)-have these folk remind the PC's strongly of people they know in the Real World,parents, teachers, classmates,pets.....
Why?
Because the Pc's ARE the Big Bads!! They are destined to bankrupt nations, start wars, become serial rapists/killers, lead suicide/terror cults....
In time, the Mists welcome them to the Hallow-there is a place for each one here, where they can no longer bring harm to the world.

But somehow(planning by thier future, monstrous selves , cosmic accident, Angelic intervention?) they were grabbed EARLY. Defeat thier twisted, future selves, face and defeat their Inner Demons in the process-and they will have changed everything,the Hallow will have no hold upon them ever again.Fail and they will be pictures on milk cartons,forever.
Despite the odds being stacked against them, the young PC's have a few edges: teamwork is alien to the swollen egos of thier monstrous alter egos.The PC's have traces of the Demon's own Powers at thier disposal(the costumes and Imagination Points). Most importantly, the PC's are NOT those creatures yet-they can work together, take off thier outfits and be Normal as needed, befriend the denizens and residents of the Hallow(indeed, they may have a few already they don't know about).
Time to take the shot at Redemption that Fate has offered-Free Will may yet trump Destiny...Go Forth!

Might be a bit heavier thematically than you were looking for, but maybe you can steal a few bits off.