I have. Adam was the third one I did actually (after Strahd and Azalin), because he's so easy to do. I'll re-arrange my release schedule to jump them to the top since you ask so politely.
You rock Ryan. I look forward to see what you've come up with.
Question occurred to me. Was it ever discussed that Adam should be a Barbarian rather than a Fighter? I know he was presented as such in Gaz 2. But Barbarian seems to fit him more. You have the Rage class feature, which goes well with a berserk flesh golem. The Barbarian is traditionally more wild and brutal in fighting style. The Fighter implies that Adam can use any weapon and indeed wear any armor without penalty. Now, I know, what DM is going to portray Adam in plate mail, so it's really a non-issue, but it's still there, right? To me the Fighter class just says more about training, whereas the Barbarian is just about hitting stuff hard.
Just wondering if there was ever any discussion or thoughts on this subject.
Ryan Naylor wrote:The problem is that as a construct with no Con score he has a pitiful number of rage rounds per day. Particularly at level 2.
Ahh yes. Never thought of that. Did anyone ever suggest doing what they do with undead and making it based on Cha? Of course...I think Adam has a pretty low Cha too, doesn't he?
The Con modifier isn't a huge factor in rage rounds, though. It will quickly get overtaken by the 4+2/level. One application of the Extra Rage feat would dwarf any reasonable Con modifier he might have had.
"We're realistic heroes. We're not here to save the world, just nudge the world into a better place."
Yes, but how many barbarian levels do you want to give him? At the moment, he'd only have 2, and he's already quite powerful.
Also, in terms of the rage, I'm not sure Adam would have a half-on, quite-but-not-completely angry setting between normal and berserk. I can see a good argument for saying if he loses his temper, he loses it completely and goes berserk rather than losing it enough to rage but not enough to go berserk.
Good points, but Berserk and Rage are two different things. Berserk just dictates who he attacks. Rage is how he attacks, with Rage. I can see the point for avoiding Barbarian, but I agree with Mortavius that Fighter does seem an odd fit. I've done the two level dip into Fighter myself, but it always feels like I'm making a cheesy feat grab.
Though, even at 2nd level barbarian, he'd have 6 rounds of rage, which isn't terrible for a guy who sits on an island all day sulking and rarely gets into multiple battles per day. Note that all he really gets out of Rage is increased Strength, since the Con bonus doesn't apply, but on the flip side, he is immune to fatigue so he comes out a rage none the worse for wear. More importantly, he'd have access to a Rage power. (I like Knockback for Adam). To each their own, I suppose. I'd like to see a fighter archetype that eschews armor for something he might actually use, but sadly Unarmed Fighter doesn't work real well for a construct.
"We're realistic heroes. We're not here to save the world, just nudge the world into a better place."
Gonzoron of the FoS wrote:Good points, but Berserk and Rage are two different things. Berserk just dictates who he attacks. Rage is how he attacks, with Rage. I can see the point for avoiding Barbarian, but I agree with Mortavius that Fighter does seem an odd fit. I've done the two level dip into Fighter myself, but it always feels like I'm making a cheesy feat grab.
Though, even at 2nd level barbarian, he'd have 6 rounds of rage, which isn't terrible for a guy who sits on an island all day sulking and rarely gets into multiple battles per day. Note that all he really gets out of Rage is increased Strength, since the Con bonus doesn't apply, but on the flip side, he is immune to fatigue so he comes out a rage none the worse for wear. More importantly, he'd have access to a Rage power. (I like Knockback for Adam). To each their own, I suppose. I'd like to see a fighter archetype that eschews armor for something he might actually use, but sadly Unarmed Fighter doesn't work real well for a construct.
Nice points Gonzoron.
Not be be a pain in the arse to anybody (I definitely agree with the "to each there own" philosophy), but why not give him ranger levels or make him a rogue (survivalist) 2. He certainly knows the lay of the land in Lamordia. I've always pictured him as more of a clever fighter than a pure brute anyway. Knowledgeable and clever, but with the tantrums of an immature child. In my opinion, one of the morals of the Frankenstein story besides the "don't try to play God" one is "don't judge a book by its cover". Making the gargantuan patchwork known as Adam into a stealthy ambushing type makes him twice as scary and dangerous.
I actually thought about both ranger and survivalist rogue, but neither of them really did anything for him.
Survivalist fits as a nice concept, but hardy does nothing for him, and (if he had 3 levels, which I'm not going to give him) he's already immune to everything that endure elements could give him as well. He does get some good skills and sneak attack though.
Ranger gives him wild empathy, which utterly contradicts his role in Lamordia - his curse is that everyone, *including the land itself*, rejects him. However, the woodland skirmisher archetype is not bad - it swaps out wild empathy for a bonus in forests. If you were so inclined, you could swap out the forest bonus for cold terrain bonuses, but actually Lamordia is foresty enough to justify either.
On berserk: I disagree that berserk just specifies what he attacks, not how. It's implicit in the name and the description (of "rampage"), not to mention what actually happens in the old Universal movies that inspired the ability.
I also don't think that fighter necessarily implies training (not to me, anyway), but each to his own.
Ryan Naylor wrote:I also don't think that fighter necessarily implies training (not to me, anyway), but each to his own.
PRD wrote:Lords of the battlefield, fighters are a disparate lot, training with many weapons or just one, perfecting the uses of armor, learning the fighting techniques of exotic masters, and studying the art of combat, all to shape themselves into living weapons. Far more than mere thugs, these skilled warriors reveal the true deadliness of their weapons, turning hunks of metal into arms capable of taming kingdoms, slaughtering monsters, and rousing the hearts of armies.
bolding added by me. But yeah, I think we've digressed enough on a matter of taste...
"We're realistic heroes. We're not here to save the world, just nudge the world into a better place."
Touché Gonzoron. Just a big fan of Frankenstein's Monster/Mordenheim's Monster.
Good point Ryan. I agree that Adam is equally inspired by the classic Hollywood character as much as the literary one. I never doubted your character build considerations for a second. Just enjoying the topic with you guys.
2. No one cares about Gabrielle Aderre or Bluebeard.
To commemorate these important findings, and because I am a kindly, even benevolent, creature, I give you Adam, and his three suspiciously similar brothers.
Last edited by Ryan Naylor on Wed Feb 13, 2013 1:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
Timeline
683 BC Created by Victor Mordenheim. (Awakened advanced flesh golem)
685 BC Eva adopted, then killed and Elise battered. Lamordia created. (Dread advanced flesh golem).
708 BC Adam kidnaps Hilda von Karlsfield.
727 BC Adam meets Merilee Markurza. Fighter 1.
737 BC Adam assaults the sanctuary of the Seekers of the Source.
739 BC Mordenheim heals Elise’s body; Adam abducts her, but adventurers steal her back. Fighter 2.
760 BC Present day.
Current Sketch
Powers Checks
Caress (Blasphemy: overtly and deliberately chooses evil: 2%; 683 BC): Increased fast healing, Wisdom penalty.
Enticement (Betrayal and Violence: obsession with Eva: 4%; 684 BC): Immune to cold.
Invitation (Betrayal and Violence: dropping Eva: 100%; 685 BC): Increased fast healing.
Embrace (Betrayal and Violence: battering Elise: 16%): Constrict, increased magic immunity
Creature (Black Magic: cursing Mordenheim: 32%): Becomes a dread golem and darklord of Lamordia. Gains telepathic link, no zeitgeber, undying soul.
Base stats
S 24 D 13 C - I 16 W 15 Ch 15 (base awakened advanced flesh golem)
Template: Modifiers from being dread golem.
Favoured class: None (construct)
CR 12 (8 [base] + 2 [levels] + 1 [template] + 1 [darklord abilities])
760 BC (Current day stats)
CR 12 XP 19,200
Male Advanced Dread Flesh Golem Fighter 2
CE Large Construct
Init: +3 (Dex) Senses: Darkvision 60 ft, low light vision, Perception +15
Defense
AC 30 Touch 12 Flat 27 (+3 Dex, +1 dodge, +18 natural, -1 size, [-2 with Lunge or Cleave])
Hp 85 (10 + 10d10 + 30), fast healing 5, DR 5/adamantium
Fort +6 Ref +6 Will +4 (immune to most spells)
Immune to most spells
Offense
Spd 40’
Melee 2 slams +19/+19 (4d6+8 plus grab, constrict; 8d6+8 with Vital Strike; crit on 19+ [12d6+16 with Vital Strike])
2 slams +16/+16 (4d6+14 plus grab, constrict with Power Attack)
Missile +14
Space/Reach: 10’/10’ (15’ with lunge)
S 24 D 17 C — I 16 W 12 Ch 15
BAB +11/+6/+1 CMB +19 CMD 33 (29)
Treasure
(16,350 gp)
Amulet of mighty fists +1, cloak of elvenkind, boots of striding and springing/boots of the winterlands.
Special
Increased magic immunity
Grab
Constrict
Immune to cold
Weakened telepathic bond
No zeitgeber
Undying soul
Sinkhole of evil
Male Advanced Dread Flesh Golem Barbarian 2
CE Large Construct
Init: +3 (Dex) Senses: Darkvision 60 ft, low light vision, Perception +15
Defense
AC 30 Touch 12 Flat 27 (+3 Dex, +1 dodge, +18 natural, -1 size)
Hp 87 (10 + 8d10 + 2d12 + 30), fast healing 5, DR 5/adamantium
Fort +6 Ref +6 Will +4 (immune to most spells)
Immune to most spells
Uncanny dodge
Offense
Spd 50’
Melee 2 slams +19/+19 (4d6+8 plus grab, constrict; crit on 19+)
Missile +14
Space/Reach: 10’/10’
S 24 D 17 C — I 16 W 12 Ch 15
BAB +11/+6/+1 CMB +19 CMD 33 (29)
Rage 6 rds
Rage power (Knockdown or Intimidating glare)
Male Advanced Dread Flesh Golem Ranger (Woodland Skirmisher) 2
CE Large Construct
Init: +3 (Dex) Senses: Darkvision 60 ft, low light vision, Perception +15
Defense
AC 30 Touch 12 Flat 27 (+3 Dex, +1 dodge, +18 natural, -1 size, [-2 with Lunge])
Hp 85 (10 + 10d10 + 30), fast healing 5, DR 5/adamantium
Fort +6 Ref +9 Will +4 (immune to most spells)
Immune to most spells
Offense
Spd 40’
Melee 2 slams +19/+19 (4d6+8 plus grab, constrict; crit on 19+)
Missile +14
Space/Reach: 10’/10’ (15’ with lunge)
S 24 D 17 C — I 16 W 12 Ch 15
BAB +11/+6/+1 CMB +19 CMD 33 (29)
Male Advanced Dread Flesh Golem Rogue 2
CE Large Construct
Init: +3 (Dex) Senses: Darkvision 60 ft, low light vision, Perception +15
Defense
AC 30 Touch 12 Flat 27 (+3 Dex, +1 dodge, +18 natural, -1 size)
Hp 83 (10 + 8d10 + 2d8 + 30), fast healing 5, DR 5/adamantium
Fort +3 Ref +9 Will +4 (immune to most spells)
Immune to most spells
Evasion
Offense
Spd 40’
Melee 2 slams +18/+18 (4d6+8 plus grab, constrict; crit on 19+)
Missile +13
Space/Reach: 10’/10’
S 24 D 17 C — I 16 W 12 Ch 15
BAB +10/+5 CMB +18 CMD 32 (28)
I look forward to see what you've come up with.
But yeah, I think we've digressed enough on a matter of taste...
