Of kings and dukes and counts

[ewancummins]

2) What you're describing is the English system of monarchy and aristocracy. There's no such thing as a European system; not every country in Euroe used the same titles or system of noble ranks.

Indeed, there was no 'feudal system' that extended across Christendom. Noble titles, ownership of land, other laws, status of knights,etc varied quite a lot from one country and one century to the next. ''Lower nobles'' don't necessarily need a king to grant them anything.

Going with the OP's idea, the Core starts to look like the HRE did for much of its history. That's cool, and rather different than what we are used to seeing. Going with canon RL, it's even more decentralized and divided- which I actually prefer.

[Garudos Celestar]

In Azalin's defense, he was the first villain to become a darklord by simply walking into the Mists. Up to then, IIRC, all the others had been deposited directly into their domains from other planes. It's possible that Azalin honestly didn't know that walking into the Mists would consign him to a domain. Rather, he might have expected to find himself Paridon or Har'Akir -- places where he could resume his escape-method research without Strahd looking over his shoulder -- just as other Mist-led travelers had, in the prior few decades.

I've always assumed the same thing - Azalin didn't enter the Mists to get a domain; he entered to get away from Strahd and figured himself powerful enough to handle whatever happened to lie on the other side of the Mists.

[Griselda]

Yea, it would. You could even have the different sects of Ezra turning against each other with political power at stake like this.

And we have numerous examples of this back here at home, the most glaringly obvious being the Babylonian Captivity (which culminated in the outrageous spectacle of three popes, elected by various means, supported by various factions, all claiming supremacy) and the Reformation/ Counter-Reformation. Infamous dust-ups like HRE Henry vs. Pope Gregory the Great, Henry VIII's quest for a divorce or the Cathari massacre could take on some really... interesting... implications when coupled with Ravenloft's unique milieu. Churches that can call on honest-to-gosh divine power are likely to have considerably more clout that those who threaten damnation but can only hope that someone comes through topside.

(Okay, everyone, close your eyes and imagine Savonarola, or Sprenger and Kramer, having God on speed-dial. *shudder*)

Since you're talking Azalin as HRE/ king, that would seem to put the Eternal Order as the official state religion. Would the Church of Ezra or the Morninglord take this lying down? Does this become the foundation for RL's own Reconquista or Reformation? Is a mystical church like Ezra's ready to put aside most of its mission statement and actively seize secular power?

Some scholars now contend that the fires of witch-hunting sometimes burned the hottest in the most contested areas of the Reformation, and that at least part of the hunts may have been a way for one side to dispose of enemies and assert political power. No one wants to be backing the wrong horse when the church sponsors bonfires, and it's a crusade just about anyone can get behind. Would the Ezrans take that step, would someone else, and who would HRE Azalin want to back?

[Garudos Celestar]

Since you're talking Azalin as HRE/ king, that would seem to put the Eternal Order as the official state religion. Would the Church of Ezra or the Morninglord take this lying down? Does this become the foundation for RL's own Reconquista or Reformation? Is a mystical church like Ezra's ready to put aside most of its mission statement and actively seize secular power?

Well, a lot of this depends on the church. Bane the Lawgiver's faith very openly ties the secular to the sacred in Hazlan and Nova Vaasa, so we might very well see this kind of confrontation if it decides to expand into Darkon or Kartakass. Of course, G'Henna is a theocracy as well, but it's too isolated to really play into this discussion.

The Church of Ezra seems unlikely to take that step at this point in its development: canon has thus far placed the church's modus operandi as existing with the permission of the secular authorities, rather than the other way around. The Home Faith in particular follows this pattern, with major portions of its political dealings revolving around "our role in the Grand Scheme is not to tick off the Dilisnyas and Boritsis." The LG faith is openly grateful to the Mordentish for giving them a place where they can practice undisturbed, and the members of the TN branch wouldn't notice the secular world if hurled a fireball in their faces (admittedly, a dominate person effect will get their attention, but that's a different thread...) The Nevuchar Springs sect is the only one that seems philosophically inclined to make a secular power play at the current time, but with at least three major religious organizations active in Darkon (not to mention Azalin's ability to remove any memories of creating a theocracy from upstarts) means that such an event is unlikely to occur.

[HuManBing]

Black Box suggests that Azalin walked deliberately into the Mists to get his domain, and I always wondered why Azalin would do such a thing. Was it just about getting the real estate? I can only assume that in his research he missed the whole double-edged darklordship and thought the prisonership would be the only drawback.

I can't remember too clearly, but I believe the only domains that popped up before Darkon did were mostly rural domains where the darklord wasn't even necessarily in evidence. Azalin may well have been completely blind to the idea that new domains bind those who make them, perhaps merely seeing it as a stepping stone effect ("I'll walk into the mists here, and create a new domain... then step over here, a little closer to my goal... and then here...").

Bear in mind that Strahd's main curse as a darklord is not so much his physical entrapment as much as his emotional entanglement with Tatyana, which Azalin may well view as a purely personal foible of Strahd and not an actual higher-ordained punishment.

[Jack the Reaper]

I've just read this thread, and well, IMC the domains are much bigger, the population is much larger, and there are some other kings around:

- Marcel Guignol of Dementlieu is a king, like Louise the XVI.
- Paridon is the capital of Mordent and Staunton Bluffs, and it has a royal family.
- In Richemulout, The real Darklord is the Rat King; a twisted being never seen or public, with personality like of king Louise XIV (described in "The Hunchback of Notredame"). Jacqueline Renier and her family are the high nobility.
- Tepest is divided by some petite "kings", something like Pridane (sp?) in the Taran series (or like the Ramtops in the Discworld novels).
- Drakov, of course, is a king; and Othmar Bolshnik is not far from it.
-As to Azalin, he is not just a king, he's the Emperor! (yes, like Palpatine in Star Wars.) Darkon itself includes several city-states, which have some measure of autonomy, but of course are all under his rule.

Yours truly,
Jack the Reaper