What if even death is no escape?

[NykylaiHellray]

I was wondering, and heard somewhere that death is the only way to escape the demiplane. Then it got me thinking, thats not particully that bad in some respects.

I thought about somthing in Final fantasy 9, and also 7. What if the mists themselves where the dead? That when you truely die you become trapped as a piece of the mist. A congelled well of souls left floating in the world, left to be controlled by the whims of the dark powers and the lords.

[The Giamarga]

Dicefreaks Kain Darkwind once put forth the theory that the Demiplane of Dread is an experiment run by the DPs - whoever they may be - and that people do not live their lives their only once but insted are somehow "respawned". This would explain the ubiqituous gloom and depression.

Basically, I suggested that the average people of Ravenloft have sort of a limited soul pool, and are eternally reincarnated and live out their lives. The cycle is probably just large enough to encompass three generations, so that no one (or barely) remembers that John the Blacksmith at 20 years old was also John the former blacksmith that died 21 years ago.

Essentially, the common folk of Ravenloft are trapped in a never ending cycle of death, rebirth and miserable life.

I've always liked the idea of souls and NPCs native to Ravenloft not being . . . exactly real, in a sense. Rather than existing in the cycle of life, death, and rebirth between the outer planes and the Mortal Coil like most other souls, the souls native to Ravenloft are creations of the Dark Powers and thus are forever bound to its borders. That's why one never hears about native Ravenloftians escaping into the Mortal Coil. Even if such a way could be found, the moment they stepped outside the Misty Borders, they would vanish entirely, body and soul, in a wisp of fog.

[vipera aspis]

this works real well with the reanimating theory: on that when you die you're sent to the misty border and if you're brought back; you come back as something a little darker(one step closer to N. evil). Maybe even reborn as a creature of mist and darkness; not even human, though most signs would say otherwise.

This could be rather creepy for a PC who starts to get "past life memories" once he's brought back.

[sndwurks]

It's always been my theory of Ravenloft that the Dark Powers themselves are actually the souls of the victims of the evil perpetrated by the Darklords, first with Strahd, and then with others. The evil they suffered was simply too great to allow them to pass on normally... so instead, they went somewhere else. Ravenloft. And as more and more evil and suffering is created, the more numerous and powerful they become, hence how the demiplane has grown.

Those native to the demiplane are merely those souls, reborn for a brief time in order to further the suffering of the Darklords... Revenge feeding into revenge, in a never-ending cycle of pain and suffering. In seeking the revenge created by the eternal curses of the Darklords, the souls who suffered have damned themselves as much as the Darklords.

But maybe that's just a rather bleak interpretation of the setting.

[Isabella]

But maybe that's just a rather bleak interpretation of the setting.

It would not help Ravenloft's general image, no.

It would present an interesting shift when it comes to the living dead. The general line is that the undead should accept that they are dead, find their peace and move on. But if they just get sucked into the mists there's no reason any undead could ever be talked into that kind of thing. Ghosts could never be put to rest. Van Richten's own son would have faced a worse fate than his vampiric state. The "happy ending", elusive in Ravenloft, would now be absolutely impossible.

In other words, I think it's an amazingly interesting idea, but I would never accept it as the official line. That's personal preference, of course. Reincarnation would be less dismal, but I'll stick with death as an escape.

[vipera aspis]

ever read/see Pet Cemetery? Thats how I would do it. sndwurks has a pretty good idea for those dark powers though.

and in response to Isabella..
"well sometimes, death is better.."

[Rotipher of the FoS]

I don't much like the idea that souls in Ravenloft just keep recycling, getting more and more evil with every generation. That might have been compatible with the early "Weekend In Hell" format for the setting, when heroes came in from outside, but if everyone born in the Land of Mists is a reiteration of some evil-natured soul, then where would we get heroic natives like Van Richten, the Weathermays, or all the homegrown PC good guys out there?


FWIW, I've actually leaned toward a completely opposite view: that those folks whom the Dark Powers draw into Ravenloft, either as darklords, lone outlanders, or the (memory-altered) populations of new domains, are people from other worlds who would have died soon anyway, had they not been snatched up. This is a possible explanation for why the higher powers-that-be that hold sway in other worlds don't oppose Mist-knapping, if the people who are carried off weren't going to be a part of their worlds-of-origin much longer anyway. So in this view, it's not dead, bitter, hopeless souls the residents of Ravenloft come from, but people from other worlds who are given a (slim and difficult) second chance.

[The Giamarga]

Well I kind of like the idea of the limited soul pool, but i don't see why they would become more evil with each incarnation. More gloomy or depressed, sure.