Bringing back the dead...

[Hallow]

Indeed.. i have had some minor death problems in my campaign, in the sense that my PC's aren't what you would call brilliant strategists.. For example, i had a wizard (2nd level) Run over to Azrael and hit him over the head with his 1/4 staff.. in which Azrael retalliated by slicing him in half with his axe (He is currently on his 3rd-4th Character). My party has trouble thinking outside of the box and is constantly getting into trouble for that, by getting either slaughtered or in a bit of trouble with the law or worse. I belive the answer to that query is merely to make a straitfoward answer to my puzzles, and role playing experiences..

However, my true question comes with resurrection magic. How is it delt with in your campaign, as i honestly am not to keen of the ideas presented in the Rl PHB or Heros of Horror.

Also... One of the above's Pc's former characters, a Warlock named Revenas is (Was) a beloved part of the group, a favorite to everyone at the table (though, he was truly a villain). My plan, since he is long dead, i plan to have him be rose again as part of Toben the Many (Toben would of course want such a powerful specimen..) Well what i hope to happen is them to slay Revenas/Toben and be stuck with the body.. Perhaps raise the former Revenas to his former glory? I'm Not entirely sure how to go about this sort of a thing.. input would be appreciated.[/b]

[Lost Heretic]

Do you have access to a copy of Ghostwalk? If someone really likes their character and that character has reason to hang onto the world of the living, perhaps they could stay on as a ghost. This could also add a very interesting new aspect to your game.


Or, you could also look into a different Campaign Setting that may be more suitable for your players.

[HuManBing]

I don't like resurrection magic at all. I think it's something that should be used extremely sparingly, by which I mean there should be at most one occurrence of it in any given campaign arc.

One idea I've been toying with is whether you could preserve the decedent's skills and mental stats by transferring them into a living person. You'd keep the living person's physical stats but retain the mental stats and skills (and one might presume, class levels) of the decedent. I haven't used this at all in any of my campaigns, but one tentative campaign arc does make use of this mechanism... after putting the relevant characters through enough magical trials, of course.

If nothing else, this could give rise to interesting role playing situations, where a newly reincarnated player has to convince his former colleagues that he is who he claims to be.

[Hallow]

I don't like resurrection magic at all. I think it's something that should be used extremely sparingly, by which I mean there should be at most one occurrence of it in any given campaign arc.

One idea I've been toying with is whether you could preserve the decedent's skills and mental stats by transferring them into a living person. You'd keep the living person's physical stats but retain the mental stats and skills (and one might presume, class levels) of the decedent. I haven't used this at all in any of my campaigns, but one tentative campaign arc does make use of this mechanism... after putting the relevant characters through enough magical trials, of course.

If nothing else, this could give rise to interesting role playing situations, where a newly reincarnated player has to convince his former colleagues that he is who he claims to be.

Hm.. I rather like that idea, actually. however, he does have a few failed powers checks, changing his phyiscal appearance.. how would the dark powers react to this?

[Joël of the FoS]

Do you have access to a copy of Ghostwalk? If someone really likes their character and that character has reason to hang onto the world of the living, perhaps they could stay on as a ghost. This could also add a very interesting new aspect to your game.

Especially when coupled with JWM's transubstancial halo

Joël

[Isabella]

IMO, the accesability of ressurection magic should be directly proportional to the number of encounters involving "save or die" abilities.

Since most Ravenloft parties don't have 5000 gp worth of diamonds in their pockets, I've never seen it as too much trouble. If they take too long to get the diamonds, the price goes up to 10,000 gp. If someone burns the body, the price skyrockets to 25,000 gp. So I personally don't mind it as is.

[Rotipher of the FoS]

Does the current adventuring party have a mid- to high-level evil cleric among its enemies? If so, you might let the bad guys do the work for a change. The evil cleric gets ahold of the dead warlock's body and restores him to life, but on the condition that the warlock becomes a spy and saboteur within the PC group. The cleric can lay a conditional curse on the warlock -- one that only strikes him if he disobeys -- to ensure his obedience.

This could be spun several ways IYC, depending on your goals for the storyline: if you want the revived warlock to be an opponent, he can act against the party under the cleric's direction; if you want him to be their ally, he can resent the cleric for trying to control him, and seek the other PCs' help in turning the tables on his "rescuer" (preferably without triggering the curse's effects). For a more complex plot, the warlock can seek the other party members' help against the cleric ... but only because he wants to be free to betray them himself.

An approach like this (i.e. resurrecting someone without the PCs' having to arrange it) shouldn't be used often, but if it's something you've never tried before on these players, it has potential.

[Hallow]

Does the current adventuring party have a mid- to high-level evil cleric among its enemies? If so, you might let the bad guys do the work for a change. The evil cleric gets ahold of the dead warlock's body and restores him to life, but on the condition that the warlock becomes a spy and saboteur within the PC group. The cleric can lay a conditional curse on the warlock -- one that only strikes him if he disobeys -- to ensure his obedience.

This could be spun several ways IYC, depending on your goals for the storyline: if you want the revived warlock to be an opponent, he can act against the party under the cleric's direction; if you want him to be their ally, he can resent the cleric for trying to control him, and seek the other PCs' help in turning the tables on his "rescuer" (preferably without triggering the curse's effects). For a more complex plot, the warlock can seek the other party members' help against the cleric ... but only because he wants to be free to betray them himself.

An approach like this (i.e. resurrecting someone without the PCs' having to arrange it) shouldn't be used often, but if it's something you've never tried before on these players, it has potential.

..
Hm.. Indeed that seems to be another facinating idea... and it just so happens that they have a couple of decent level clerics as foes.. In fact i allmost forgot about how in the 3rd session, they burned down a church of an evil deity... hm.. vengence quest?

[Jester of the FoS]

Indeed.. i have had some minor death problems in my campaign, in the sense that my PC's aren't what you would call brilliant strategists.. My party has trouble thinking outside of the box and is constantly getting into trouble for that, by getting either slaughtered or in a bit of trouble with the law or worse. I belive the answer to that query is merely to make a straitfoward answer to my puzzles, and role playing experiences..

My first thought to this complaint (now that it has popped up more than once) is to give them a foe they cannot beat through normal means (but perhaps not a deadly one) and/or introduce them to a mentor (vanRichten is the easiest).

[kottakinge]

Hello.
I have to deal with that last session, where the bard died.
He was a 9th level bard.
The party were in Mordent, two of them are Ezra followers (a priest and a palladin), they bring back the body of their fallen comrade to the Bastion of the cathedral and she told them maybe Ezra will bring her mercy on their comrade, if the legions of the night didn't take his soul, because the grey realm is uncertain.
First they have to find 5k gp, they don't have even the quarter of this money, so Van Richten give them the remainigs GP.
Even if they had the money to buy the diamond powder there is a risk that raise dead fell and that the bard rose as an undead.
He did well with the dice so he was alive.
That was short! so even if it's possible it's a hard think to be ressurecte in Ravenloft even if you follow stricly the rules.
All of these was possible because they all know well the bastion of Ezra.
Such miracle is only possible for peaople who worth it in the eyes of the high priestess.

[Hallow]

Indeed.. i have had some minor death problems in my campaign, in the sense that my PC's aren't what you would call brilliant strategists.. My party has trouble thinking outside of the box and is constantly getting into trouble for that, by getting either slaughtered or in a bit of trouble with the law or worse. I belive the answer to that query is merely to make a straitfoward answer to my puzzles, and role playing experiences..

My first thought to this complaint (now that it has popped up more than once) is to give them a foe they cannot beat through normal means (but perhaps not a deadly one) and/or introduce them to a mentor (vanRichten is the easiest).

Hm.. I tried that a couple of times. Each time, the group gets the crap kicked out of them.. and isn't Van Richten dead?

[Ail]

Indeed.. i have had some minor death problems in my campaign, in the sense that my PC's aren't what you would call brilliant strategists.. My party has trouble thinking outside of the box and is constantly getting into trouble for that, by getting either slaughtered or in a bit of trouble with the law or worse. I belive the answer to that query is merely to make a straitfoward answer to my puzzles, and role playing experiences..

My first thought to this complaint (now that it has popped up more than once) is to give them a foe they cannot beat through normal means (but perhaps not a deadly one) and/or introduce them to a mentor (vanRichten is the easiest).

Hm.. I tried that a couple of times. Each time, the group gets the crap kicked out of them.. and isn't Van Richten dead?

Officially, it has never been decided. There are three possible endings for Bleak House, and I think one of them allows for VR to be alive. Then, of course, it's your campaign. You could decide he changed name and made a surgery to enjoy his retirement years in peace while his 'nieces' take on the hard work

Alex

[kottakinge]

Death, in my campaign, occured when a player do something wrong or when they're outnumbered by ennemies or not enough prepared (this mean buffed in 3.5 )
Because it's very complicated to be ressurected (the cost and the chance of being an undead) when a character die in most cases it's over, and it teachs him a good lesson for not being precautious enough.
So if ur players often dies, then considere they don't learn, don't permit a resssurection.
When will they be considered heroes if they always die at each session (like kenny in south park!!)?Never, so the world need heroes not dumb-ass who run after their doom.
Maybe it's a bad idea to confront them with powerful ennemie (like Azrael) or just permit a few combat during your session, make them learn about who is really their ennemy before they fight him.

[Hallow]

Death, in my campaign, occured when a player do something wrong or when they're outnumbered by ennemies or not enough prepared (this mean buffed in 3.5 )
Because it's very complicated to be ressurected (the cost and the chance of being an undead) when a character die in most cases it's over, and it teachs him a good lesson for not being precautious enough.
So if ur players often dies, then considere they don't learn, don't permit a resssurection.
When will they be considered heroes if they always die at each session (like kenny in south park!!)?Never, so the world need heroes not dumb-ass who run after their doom.
Maybe it's a bad idea to confront them with powerful ennemie (like Azrael) or just permit a few combat during your session, make them learn about who is really their ennemy before they fight him.

Indeed though i was running the Black Rose adventure, in which the party meets Azrael... and my wizard PC thought it was a good idea to attack him with a quarter staff. I later asked him why in the bloody hell did he do this, and he replyed that he though azrael was a Necromancer..

[kottakinge]

ndeed though i was running the Black Rose adventure, in which the party meets Azrael... and my wizard PC thought it was a good idea to attack him with a quarter staff. I later asked him why in the bloody hell did he do this, and he replyed that he though azrael was a Necromancer..

I see.
But he was a 2nd level wizard! and he runs toward a "maybe" necromancer to give him a lesson with his quaterstaff?
Hmm a 2nd level wizard knowledge about the quaterstaff is when he sweep the laboratory of his master with a broom

But players do stupid things sometimes, one of my player, a 7th fighter/1st level palladin insult a troup of 6 falkovnian mercenaries in heavy armor and halebards, he manage to survive 3 rounds and to mortally wounded one of them before being ripped apart and put into the commander garden with his body on a stake
That was game over for him!