Masque of the Jade Dragon?

[Jonathan Winters]

Hello,

I don't think I saw this being covered anywhere else and I am posting it here because I figure it is more of a general RL question now that the setting has been cancelled.

But does anyone know what MotJD was supposed to be?
And can you tell us about it?
Maybe the Frat boys know someone who knows someone?

See ya!

Patrick

[Jasper]

It was a verson of masque of the red death but detailnig the Eastern part of the world. It would cover how the Red death corupted the spirts of anchient china and the types of horror that arose from it.

[Jonathan Winters]

Hey Jasper!

I thought this was what people ASSUMED it was going to be...

Is this an official answer we got?

Somehow, I may be wrong, but I remember (I think) the Dark Duo saying it would be very different from MotRD, some kind of twist to it... But not much else was said...

Thanks!

Patrick

[Coan]

There was some mention of new magic. But I would say the project was in the to early to tell phase when it was shelved. Now we will probably never know.

For what it is worth I believe there was a thread in the Gothic Earth area about this, plus this thread is probably more suited there.

[ScS of the Fraternity]

The contents of the much alluded to Masque of the Jade Dragon have been speculated upon, but never confirmed.

I, personally, believe that Jade Dragon was never defined. It was probably proposed out of desperation to create a new product for the Ravenloft line.

This is my theory, wrong though it might be:

In the dying days, Arthus demanded that the Ravenloft line start selling more. In a situation more akin to a Knights of the Dinner Table cartoon, the WW staff started pitching wild. They knew that they needed something to bump up sales, and that whatever it was, it would have to be costly to generate the profits needed.
But what could they possibly publish as a big $40+ book? They had pleanty of ideas (ex: guide to madmen), but nothing that would warant a hardcover. What could possibly fill the void?
Why, only another campaign setting, of course.
The Red Death was, and still is, the only other setting in the Ravenloft line. It makes sense that it would be the template for whatever came next.
However, I imagine that part of the attraction to a Masque of the _, was that continuity was not a factor. Theoretically, they could have hired any odd writer, given him or her the name, and let him or her go to work. No time would be lost checking for continuity and, as we know from Masque of the Red Death, they surely wouldn't have wasted any time Editing it.

[Rucht Lilavivat]

I, personally, believe that Jade Dragon was never defined. It was probably proposed out of desperation to create a new product for the Ravenloft line.

No, this is not the case.

[Coan]

The contents of the much alluded to Masque of the Jade Dragon have been speculated upon, but never confirmed.

I, personally, believe that Jade Dragon was never defined. It was probably proposed out of desperation to create a new product for the Ravenloft line.

Your dislike of the published 3.5 edition MotRD edition has been known for some time. However Masque of the Jade Dragon had been mentioned a while before the fall of Ravenloft and they had talked to authors to begin writing it (to what extent I am not sure) which implies a certain degree of planning. Bringing back Masque of the Red Death to a published update was a good idea despite the oft mentioned editing issues.

[Faust]

If you want to play in gothic earth you are better off with using the d20 modern rules anyway.

[Don Fernando]

I must agree with ScS with this. The quality of MotRD 3rd. Ed. was very low. Now we all know that WW is around for sometime now so there is no blaming on the company for such a poor quality book. After I read the book, it was clear to me that the authors wrote this book in quite a hurry, with no clear plan whatsoever. And I guess the editors where on vacation when the book was ready to be edited. This denotes poor planning. So, to me MotJD was another quick book to mantain the sales and nothing more. Of course, there was a plan behind it, if not it would have been worse than MotRD, I suppose.

But returning to the topic, I guess this book was about the red death influence in the Asian countries, and perhaps the Jade Dragon was a new ally of the Read Death.

[Coan]

I must agree with ScS with this. The quality of MotRD 3rd. Ed. was very low. Now we all know that WW is around for sometime now so there is no blaming on the company for such a poor quality book. After I read the book, it was clear to me that the authors wrote this book in quite a hurry, with no clear plan whatsoever. And I guess the editors where on vacation when the book was ready to be edited. This denotes poor planning. So, to me MotJD was another quick book to mantain the sales and nothing more. Of course, there was a plan behind it, if not it would have been worse than MotRD, I suppose.

But returning to the topic, I guess this book was about the red death influence in the Asian countries, and perhaps the Jade Dragon was a new ally of the Read Death.

So you don't think that perhaps they had learned from their mistakes? MatJD could easily have surpassed the low bar set by the people around here if feedback was taken on board. However I must reiterate the obvious that what this book's planning may or may not have been is moot. We will probably never know.

As for d20 Modern rules for Gothic Earth I think that is a bad idea. The Masque rules (book or fan created by the Living Death website) as well as Ravenloft rules add so much more -madness, magic corruption etc. I dont have a problem with d20 Modern rules really, if you want to play super heros or an action movie game then yes it is the set of rules you want. But Masque and other such games (Call of Cthulu based for example) require human characters with very real weaknesses and not supra human abilities all over.

[ScS of the Fraternity]

So you don't think that perhaps they had learned from their mistakes?

If they didn't learn from their successes, why would they learn from failure? Though I imagine that failure is an exageration - the book probably turned a profit anyway.

MatJD could easily have surpassed the low bar set by the people around here if feedback was taken on board.

Low bar? I'm pretty sure we have a high bar for our expectations - hence my constant bitching and moaning.

However I must reiterate the obvious that what this book's planning may or may not have been is moot. We will probably never know.

Not unless one of the contributors spills the beans....

As for d20 Modern rules for Gothic Earth I think that is a bad idea. The Masque rules (book or fan created by the Living Death website) as well as Ravenloft rules add so much more -madness, magic corruption etc. I dont have a problem with d20 Modern rules really, if you want to play super heros or an action movie game then yes it is the set of rules you want. But Masque and other such games (Call of Cthulu based for example) require human characters with very real weaknesses and not supra human abilities all over.

Now here, I would disagree.
D20 modern has the excellent advantage of allowing players to play as mundane heroes. You can have bar-bouncers, shop-lifters, construction workers, librarians, social workers, and even tv personalities. The key attribute is flexability. You can make any of the above a viable character, with skills and abilties that tie directly into their archetype.
In an 1890s campaign, using the very same classes above, you could create a Masi warrior, a chimney sweep, a ship-hand, a nutty inventor, a missionary or a snakeoil salesman.

The basic D&D based rules, while extremely fun, make it difficult to create viable characters. The issue here is specificity; the individual classes are only designed to fulfil one and only one archetype. If you want to play something that isn't specified, you pretty much have to create a new class.

[Coan]

Now here, I would disagree.
D20 modern has the excellent advantage of allowing players to play as mundane heroes. You can have bar-bouncers, shop-lifters, construction workers, librarians, social workers, and even tv personalities. The key attribute is flexability. You can make any of the above a viable character, with skills and abilties that tie directly into their archetype.
In an 1890s campaign, using the very same classes above, you could create a Masi warrior, a chimney sweep, a ship-hand, a nutty inventor, a missionary or a snakeoil salesman.

The basic D&D based rules, while extremely fun, make it difficult to create viable characters. The issue here is specificity; the individual classes are only designed to fulfil one and only one archetype. If you want to play something that isn't specified, you pretty much have to create a new class.

I agree with the D&D rules statement and in Modern yes you could be a chimney sweep if you picked the job. However that chimney sweep would be able to have huge hit points and does become pretty much the same as any other of its major class (fast, tough, strong etc). d20 Past is mostly regarded as the worst d20 Modern supplement and d20 Modern itself fails to display just how taxing the world would be on a person. Modern is for heros not for ordinary people charged with a great task (it even mentions this on the back -cinematic action).

[Matthew L. Martin]

The problem with your argument, Coan, is that D&D is even worse in such regards.

You're going to have to modify d20 to get what you want in any case, but in the eyes of many, Modern makes a far easier starting point than D&D.

That said, I understand why WWGS didn't go with Modern--WotC wouldn't allow it, and the book's target market was largely Ravenloft fans, who would almost certainly own the D&D core books but may not own Modern.

Matthew L. Martin

[Drinnik Shoehorn]

The problem with your argument, Coan, is that D&D is even worse in such regards.

You're going to have to modify d20 to get what you want in any case, but in the eyes of many, Modern makes a far easier starting point than D&D.

That said, I understand why WWGS didn't go with Modern--WotC wouldn't allow it, and the book's target market was largely Ravenloft fans, who would almost certainly own the D&D core books but may not own Modern.

Matthew L. Martin

Saying that, I don't know why they didn't get the Living Death authors on it. There was one, I think, but they could have got more.

Granted, this maybe a case of me misremembering something.

[Coan]

The problem with your argument, Coan, is that D&D is even worse in such regards.

You're going to have to modify d20 to get what you want in any case, but in the eyes of many, Modern makes a far easier starting point than D&D.

That said, I understand why WWGS didn't go with Modern--WotC wouldn't allow it, and the book's target market was largely Ravenloft fans, who would almost certainly own the D&D core books but may not own Modern.

Matthew L. Martin

D&D may be worse but I think Masque answers the problems quite well (either book or LD material wise).

Of course if we all really wanted the best and most realistic stuff I'd go to Alternity.