Ravenloft vs midnight

[Faust]

So what is your tought about midnight? Is it good? As good as rl? Do you think it will replace rl as the most popular dark dnd setting?
And also what do you think of the classes of midnight?

[Catman Jim]

So what is your thought about Midnight? Do you think it will replace RL as the most popular dark dnd setting?

It doesn't appeal to me. Midnight appears to be a high-fantasy dark setting while Ravenloft is primarily a low-fantasy gothic horror setting. I see Midnight as being a Middle-Earth where the Dark Lord is currently in power. Here's how the manufacturer describes it. (and try replacing the name of the fallen god Izrador with 'Sauron' ) http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/mnland.html
As to it replacing RL as most popular, I couldn't hazard a guess. I thought RL3E was doing well in sales, but with the reduction in releases planned for 2005, that is apparently not so.

[Maximillian]

Really? These are bad news indeed... Does anyone actually know, how well does RL sale? Could the Dark Duo perhaps provide as with an indication?

[Faust]

well the sales are not bad, but my guess is that white wolf dont make enough profit with it to make it continue, I mean their other world, scarred land I think, was selling more than rl but they ended the line abruptly.

But well I like midnight as much as rl so it does not matter that much to me...

[Jester of the FoS]

I wonder if they end it if the Fraternity can wrangle the right to produce products.

Midnight sounds cool but I agree that it's pretty much a rip-off of LotR, more so that most settings. But a neat idea regardless. So many worlds have the dark god or evil force of nature. It's very cool that someone finally said "so hey, what happens if he'd have won?" It'd be interesting for a change but I still think I'll stick with Ravenloft.

[Mortepierre]

It's kind of surprising we don't get more RL products given 6 of the top ten best sales of S&S are currently RL accessories!

[Maximillian]

Perhaps S&S, or WW for that matter goes through rough times... The Scarred Lands is discontinued, RL is getting a thorough release trimming and I don't know how the fanbase reacted to the cleansweep of the World of Darkness during Gehenna. From what I heard from "Vampire" players they are not exactly overenthusiastic with the new Vampire setting and storyline. The status quo before Gehenna was deeply rooted among the fans and this new, almost "heretical" approach, is not guaranteed to sell as much. These are educated guesses though. If anyone knows more substantial info, I would be interested in hearing it.

[Jester of the FoS]

Throw in the release of Eberron and the updated Dragonlance for competition and the ever popular Realms and you have a pretty darn divided audience for a niche market.

[BlackBoxGamer]

I'm not sure if the following is true beyond my local scene, but it comes from two sources that are in-the-know locally. It seems the month of December was not as good a month in sales for RPG products as many would hope. In fact, compared to previous years, RPG sales were pretty low.

As for Vampire: The Requiem, I was a fan of the old Vampire, and the new one seems to have a nice, cleaned up rules system, with an interesting setting, but I just can't seem to get into it. Honestly, it perks my interest, but I just don't want to get into it. I'm not sure of all the reasons, but a big factor for me is the stupid, hard to read heading font they use that's printed in red ink (it just bugs me to look at it; don't know why). Another factor is what White Wolf did when they took control of the Camarilla a few years back, but that's a rant I won't go into.

BBG

[Reginald de Curry]

As to it replacing RL as most popular, I couldn't hazard a guess. I thought RL3E was doing well in sales, but with the reduction in releases planned for 2005, that is apparently not so.

According to Shane Hensley (Deadlands.com), the entire gaming industry is in a slump. I'd guess that RL is doing as well as it can, under the circumstances.

[ScS of the Fraternity]

Shane knows his business, but one wonders if roleplaying has ever not been in a slump.

[Jester of the FoS]

When D&D, the big revamp of 3E was released, it did draw huge numbers back into the fold. Everyone wanted to check out the new line and related products and pick up the initial updates of their favorite settings as well as all the 3rd party d20 products.
Then a large majority of people bought all they needed, you really only need 3 books.
Sales probably spiked again after the release of 3.5E and all the related 'patches' but this would have been negligible and noticeable numbers of people would have migrated to other systems and games in protest of the perceived needless update.
The RPG industry was in a boom for the previous 3-4 years and it has just now caught up with us. It's not in a slump so much as it is returning to normality.

Throw in that the market has probably grown but now there is a wide variety of sub-settings and new products lines and the like. Plus collectible card games. Plus collectible mini games. Plus computer games.

There is probably more people than ever playing D&D and all related and peripheral RPGs but they are spread out more than ever.

And let’s not forget the fun-fun fan element that, empowered by the wonders of the internet, has the ability to preach their small, trivial opinions and concerns at high volumes to many people calling for boycotts and the like.

[Catman Jim]

and let's not forget the fun-fun fan element that, empowered by the wonders of the internet, has the ability to preach their small, trivial opinions and concerns at high volumes to many people calling for boycotts and the like.

Hmm, I hadn't heard anything like that in quite a while. Is there something new going around, or is it the same old unfounded fears that we've heard for over 20 years?

[Jester of the FoS]

I'm refering to the standard "3.5 is a marketing rip-off designed to get more money, nobody buy it!!" or "Pimp: the Backhanding premotes violence againts women, nobody buy it!!"
The fans getting all upset over some stupid trivial fear and shouting out against it and decrying anyone who disagrees with them.

[Shadow]

I don't care for Midnight that much. It has some neat ideas, but it is essentially high fantasy (albeit in a dark setting). One of the main appeals of Ravenloft IMHO is the rather "low fantasy" (for lack of a better word) feel. There are a lot of secrets and magic, but they remain lurking below the surface. Moreover, much of Ravenloft is left purposely vague and unstated as to allow the DM to craft the world as he sees fit (eg. the dark powers, the false histories of many domains, etc.)