Vampyre vampire?

[tomokaicho]

Vampyre, page 218 Denizens of Dread. Vampyres are Monstrous Humanoid predators that feed on blood. Vampyres have a healthy 8 Monstrous Humanoid racial HD. Has there ever been any published instances of vampyres being turned into actual undead vampires. Canon and fanon all OK.

[Rock of the Fraternity]

None I know of. It seems Vampyres detest vampires (maybe they find them offensive because they are an undead perversion of their own once-divine mandate to 'cull the herd'?), so they might go out of their way to avoid being turned and to destroy any of their own kind who are.

[tomokaicho]

None I know of. It seems Vampyres detest vampires (maybe they find them offensive because they are an undead perversin of their own once-divine mandate to 'cull the herd'?), so they might go out of their way to avoid being turned and to destroy any of their own kind who are.

If that is the case, vampyres certainly had the HD to do it. And its 'good' Monstrous Humanoid HD too. Lots of capacity for violence.

[Rock of the Fraternity]

They also have the advantage of Darkvision and good senses; less chance for vampires to sneak up on them in the dark, since they're both nocturnal predators.
Now they just need the right gear; Vampyre teeth and claws wouldn't cut it against a vampire. And even if they did, drinking vampire blood would likely lead to a turning.

[tomokaicho]

Vampyres are advancement: by character class. Favored class is fighter. I bet most would have levels in fighter too.

One thing I am struggling to figure out is the starting stats for the entry in Denizens of Darkness. 15, 12, 13, 15, 12, 17 is what is given. 11, 11, 11, 10, 10, 10 is the standard array. The entry contains a section about vampyre characters, but does not include the ability score adjustments. Oops.

We don't know if the vampire presented uses the standard array or the elite array. If its the standard array then the abilities scores bonus is possibly the following.

Str +4, Dex +2, Con +3, Int +4, Wis +2, Cha +4. I am assuming that the higher ability scores started at 11 instead of 10. I am also assuming that the ability score bonus from levelling to 8 HD (+2) went to Charisma.

That makes a vampyre with PC levels and elite array an absolute monster.

Hold on - as I was writing this, I found something suggesting that all monsters that advance by character class do use the elite array, whether they have class levels or not. Lets see if I can whip something up.

Elite array: 15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8.
Vampyre: 15, 12, 13, 15, 12, 15 (assumed base stats before HD).

Actually - I give up for now. Its almost midnight here and I suspect there is some deeper problem with this creature design.

[Mephisto of the FoS]

Well Blade (daywalker, vampyre) did a lot of stuff with his weapons and think about Quintus the barbarian gladiator from The Strain. I don't remember a specific scene where they used their teeth in battle but I am almost sure they did. There is no scene whatsoever of them using their teeth to drink blood.

[Rock of the Fraternity]

I think Blade is a Dhampir, not a Vampyre.

[tomokaicho]

Well Blade (daywalker, vampyre) did a lot of stuff with his weapons and think about Quintus the barbarian gladiator from the strain. I don't remember a specific scene where they used their teeth in battle but I am almost sure they did. There is no scene whatsoever of them using their teeth to drink blood.

As Rock mentioned, those are Dhampir, not Vampyre. Easy mistake. Dhampir is on page 55 of Denizens of Dread. Now that you mention it, a Dhampir Vampyr is possible too. What a mess.

[Mephisto of the FoS]

As Rock mentioned, those are Dhampir, not Vampyre. Easy mistake. Dhampir is on page 55 of Denizens of Dread. Now that you mention it, a Dhampir Vampyr is possible too. What a mess.

Blade is a vampyre he is not an offspring of a vampire.

"In 1967, a pregnant woman is attacked by a vampire, causing her to go into premature labor. Doctors are able to save her baby, but the woman dies of an unknown infection."

It is somehow similar of how Tristen ApBlanc became a vampyre.*

I personally don't like the idea of Dhampirs unless if they are created/born under specific circumstances like Duke Nharov Gundar's son Medraut.
Duke Gundar may be a vampire but his curse is that he actually ages and may even not be considered immortal in the full sense of the word.
So I would consider most Dhampirs in Ravenloft being children of the many concubines Duke Gundar has, he is after all the psychopathic harem type of villan although he could seem also psychotic in his appearance.

My reason for disliking Dhampir's except of the forementioned reasons is that if vampires in Ravenloft could have children as mortal folk then the world would be full of Dhampirs, as vampires can be charming, polyamoral and in the case of male vampires impregnate many women.

*though in 5e Tristen is a Dhampir...

[Rock of the Fraternity]

I actually liked the explanation that the first Blade movie gave for his dhampir status; that he was not the son of a human and a vampire, but that he had been contaminated with whatever transformative agent is in a vampire's saliva in utero, because a vampire attacked his mother.

If we use that concept, then the relative scarcity of dhampir in Ravenloft is understandable; medical science is not as advanced there as it is in the Marvel universe. If a pregnant woman is assaulted by a vampire in Ravenloft and goes into premature labor, the odds are even more likely that both mother and child will die.

[Mistmaster]

Dhampyrs can be born both way, and in my vision, they can also be born by two Dhampyr genitors; A Vampire, however, have to be well fed to be able to sire a child and that is what keeps Dhampyr to a bare minimum. A Vampire would expose himself to feed enought to sire a Dhampir often.

[Rock of the Fraternity]

Also, most vampires would probably consider a Dhampir a security risk unless they could get them under control from the get-go.

[Mephisto of the FoS]

I actually liked the explanation that the first Blade movie gave for his dhampir status;

But Blade is not a dhampir (dhampirs are the offspring of vampires) he is more like a good aligned vampyre.

that he was not the son of a human and a vampire, but that he had been contaminated with whatever transformative agent is in a vampire's saliva in utero, because a vampire attacked his mother.

Already canon since Castles Forlorn, "attacked" doesn't necessarily mean that it was a savage attack it could be a vampires kiss.

If we use that concept, then the relative scarcity of dhampir in Ravenloft is understandable; medical science is not as advanced there as it is in the Marvel universe.

Speaking about premature labor, probably a caesarean section would be applicable but historically, a caesarean section, performed upon a live woman, usually resulted in the death of the mother. It was long considered an extreme measure, performed only when the mother was already dead or considered to be beyond help.

As a surgical procedure it has been used since ancient times, the first recorded C-section was recorded in 1030 BC in Ancient China, then India it was used by the Romans.The Roman Lex Regia (royal law), later the Lex Caesarea (imperial law), of Numa Pompilius (715–673 BC), required the child of a mother who had died during childbirth to be cut from her womb. That is were the name of the operation comes from.

There is some indirect evidence that the first caesarean section that was survived by both the mother and child was performed in Prague in 1337.

Even in the 1991 movie Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves with Kevin Costner, Morgan Freeman plays a Moor who has knowledge of doing the surgery as Arabs in the Middle Ages were more advanced than people living in Western Europe.

So anyway the résumé is that birth complications would usually result in the death of the mother not the baby, so Dhampirs could easily increase in numbers considering that vampires are highly self centered creatures who can easily have many offspring if they are able to reproduce. Mistmaster gives a good example of lowering the numbers of Dhampirs, but still what does overfed mean exactly, it is not like an overfed vampire is lethargic as a well-fed anaconda.

IIf a pregnant woman is assaulted by a vampire in Ravenloft and goes into premature labor, the odds are even more likely that both mother and child will die.

Assaulted doesn't mean necessarily a violent attack it could be as fore-mentioned a vampires kiss to a charmed victim. A dhampir as it is in canon is just an offspring of a vampire and a humanoid woman (apparently female vampires are unable to give birth) and there are no complications mentioned in Denizens of Darkness.

This is the problem with a dhampirs as they are, they should be numerous. Children born vampyres by humanoid mothers (not vampyres) are the result of a vampires kiss on an impregnated woman, the toxins in a vampires saliva mutating the child in the womb. Actually in Castles Forlorn there was the "early dread possibility" of holy water being able to cure a child from these toxins if used before killing a human being or something similar. It stated that a child born that way would turn into a vampire while growing. It was Ruals blessed with holy water blood that changed Tristen ApBlanc, possibly curing him of his vampirism.

Also, most vampires would probably consider a Dhampir a security risk unless they could get them under control from the get-go.

This explanation is more logical, it could be that creating offspring is taboo among vampires for good reasons (to not create dangerous daywalkers) but vampiric lore is not necessarily known to all vampires. In the movie Interview with a vampire the European vampires believe that a child vampire is dangerous for them because of the threat they pose as being easily exposed if not considered as abominations

VIEW CONTENT:

and they kill the child vampire... R.I.P. Merilee Markuza

Also DoDarkness states that a dhampir rarely knows of it's vampire heritage because their mothers almost never survive childbirth.
Their unded sires rarely bother to keep track on them and are often surprised if confronted by their offspring.

[Rock of the Fraternity]

Rather, I'd imagine an overfed vampire to get hyper and careless; so buzzed from being full of blood that it gets cocky and keeps feeding wildly, without a care for the consequences.

[Mephisto of the FoS]

Rather, I'd imagine an overfed vampire to get hyper and careless; so buzzed from being full of blood that it gets cocky and keeps feeding wildly, without a care for the consequences.

A first-class-well-fed a***ole