What happened with that dead DL?

[WolfKook]

Hi, everyone.

I was wondering, there are several escape clauses for darklords to continue their existence after death (Mordenheim reappears somewhere else, Ivan Dilisnya does something similar, Malken takes the body of one of Tristen's offspring, etc), and I have always guessed that they come from 2e, as a way of keeping the power of the darklords -most of which were fragile 0-level humans back then -with so many adventurous PCs rampaging around trying to kill them.

Many people from these boards have also addressed their love (or hate) for particular darklords, and as I guess there are several creative DMs out there, who don't always follow the rules to the letter, I wanted to know what have you done when your PCs have killed any of the darklords. Have you followed the written stuff, or have you ruled otherwise? Have you ruled that they were to stay dead, or have you made them return in a creative way? What do you think should happen to your favorite DLs once they die?

Just wondering...

[HuManBing]

The only Darklords that my PCs have killed off to date are Gundar and Azalin, and the "killing" of Azalin was only his mortal body, not his phylactery. Both occurred in the course of adventures. Gundar was killed in the course of Feast of Goblyns where I added him as an NPC. (I added another leg to the adventure where the PCs head up a strike team to unseat Gundar, led by Daclaud Heinfroth.)

Azalin's "death" occurred in From the Shadows and was entirely planned and intended by Azalin himself. He still managed to put a lot of holes in the party, however. (If I recall correctly, we had four players, and either six or seven PCs, because some players were controlling multiple PCs. That made it less bothersome for me to kill off a few as a demonstration of his power.)

Gundar's death is canon anyway, so nothing changed there. It did require a fairly lengthy assault style adventure in and around Castle Hunedora, Gundar's redoubt. After that, I let the PCs accompany Heinfroth and Akriel on a few coffin-staking missions, to give them an idea of how exhaustive it is to truly destroy a powerful vampire.

As for Azalin's death, it wasn't even permanent. The entire party was pretty rattled up just facing him in toe-to-toe combat once (and they'd even managed to bring him 4 levels down using the "kill the familiar" 2nd ed. trick, which goes to show).

So, to conclude, I generally don't kill off darklords unless the story calls for it. However, the ones that make their living more by deceit and manipulation might well be killable, especially as the Gazetteers seem to include hints and possible leads about who could succeed them.

Gabrielle Aderre was a killable darklord in The Evil Eye, and Yagno Petrovna was killable in Circle of Darkness. Other darklords that I'd imagine would fall into the same mould would include Jacqueline Renier, Ivan Dilisnya, and Ivana Boritsi - all of whom are basically your normal human being (or thereabouts, in Renier's case) who gets by on their influence and charisma rather than raw power.

Other darklords who, despite being combat-ready, don't seem to have any special death-ward powers are: Vlad Drakov (although killing him in the first place is no easy task), Von Kharkov, and Malken.

Finally you have darklords that are basically unkillable. Azalin is physically very powerful and can reappear as long as his phylactery is intact. Strahd likewise is very hard to defeat in combat and he'll keep coming back if the PCs can't find each one of his coffins. Harkon Lukas is easier to beat, but to make sure he doesn't return, you'd have to kill every last wolf in Kartakass.

[Rotipher of the FoS]

FWIW, I've had to "unkill" a darklord for the Nocturnal Sea Gaz, in order to explain why Meredoth is still kicking, despite being taken down by "outlander brigands" in the early days of Hyskosa's Hexad. As he was not defined as unkillable in his DoD description, I opted to let the old coot return in a more conventional evil-D&D-necromancerly fashion... albeit not without a few unforseen side effects. (This is Ravenloft, after all... )

[Spiteful Crow]

FWIW, I've had to "unkill" a darklord for the Nocturnal Sea Gaz, in order to explain why Meredoth is still kicking, despite being taken down by "outlander brigands" in the early days of Hyskosa's Hexad. As he was not defined as unkillable in his DoD description, I opted to let the old coot return in a more conventional evil-D&D-necromancerly fashion... albeit not without a few unforseen side effects. (This is Ravenloft, after all... )

HAHAHAHAHA! I remember asking "What happens to the Nocturnal Sea?!" on here when I read through Ship of Horror.

Can't wait to see what you came up with.

[DeepShadow of FoS]

In one campaign, I had a group of PC's who killed Harkon Lucas four times, and each time he got better and better at fighting them. Adam also came back, after a scheming NPC forced him off a cliff in order to open the borders for the party.

As I've chronicled elsewhere, I had Godefroy killed off permanently by a PC and his allies in Awakenings. There, I also had Elena return as a death knight, and there was talk of Drakov coming back after he was killed, so I've brought back folks who didn't have the Undying Soul power.

In Reckonings, Pieter went down with his ship, so he's not coming back, and Bluebeard didn't have such a safety net, so he's staying dead. I've got a fate planned for Draga that would short out his Undying Soul ability, which the PC's may or may not figure out.

Come to think of it, DL's might have a much shorter life expectancy in my games. I consider them expendable against the backdrop of the greater storyline. I don't do it out of hand, but when the pathos is right, I drop the axe as...punctuation

BTW, you say Ivan has an undying soul, but I'm not aware of any such rule. Care to clarify?

[Rotipher of the FoS]

Can't wait to see what you came up with.

Don't expect anything super-radical there, as Meredoth's about as traditional of a "D&D wizard villain" as you'll find in Ravenloft, and I opted to run with that rather than break with his prior image. (OTOH, being the traditional "D&D warlord villain" hasn't done Drakov much good, and the cantankerous ol' crank in Todstein might be considered his arcane equivalent.) True to his Alphatian nationality and his own character, the darklord of Nebligtode snobbishly ignores the trivial inconveniences that came about with his temporary demise ... and has completely overlooked the real threat to his power which has emerged since his return.

The Grabens pulled through too, BTW.

[Spiteful Crow]

The Grabens pulled through too, BTW.

With all of their bodyparts intact?

[Rotipher of the FoS]

With all of their bodyparts intact?

[WolfKook]

I also had the idea of Elena returning as a Death Knight, and Yagno Petrovna turning into a famine spirit (Though not quite the MMII version... I have created a template to that end). I also see Ivana dying in quite a spectacular way, with her body melting as the poison in her veins consumes her, and with the PCs having to keep away from her blood.

I don't quite like the Undying Soul ability, and I would certainly let my PCs kill off permanently most of the darklords, without returning them later. Perhaps the only exception to that would be Malken, and that just because the Undying Soul is part of his curse. That is not to say that anyone should have it easy when meddling with the DLs.

Quote of the Week: (As the character were staying in Levkarest) "Where can I go to purchase some poison?"

[Garudos Celestar]

Quote of the Week: (As the character were staying in Levkarest) "Where can I go to purchase some poison?"

Appropriate reply: *points to the nearest windowsill flower box*

[steveflam]

Quote of the Week: (As the character were staying in Levkarest) "Where can I go to purchase some poison?"

Appropriate reply: *points to the nearest windowsill flower box*

My quote is: My players are robbing a general store and leave one p.c guard in case the nightwatch shows up. As luck would have it they do and when they ask him what he is doing, he replies with a straight face "Oh I'm here standing watch while my friends rob the general store over there".

[Lost Heretic]

And that, Tarlyn, is why Kender do not work well as is in Ravenloft.

[Gwenfloor]

In my campaign, Maligno was killed by the PCs, and Odiare was absorbed into Valachan. The Odiarans and the Valachani just recently found out about each other's existence. A population that is not under Von Kharkov's control could be damning to his rule. Several Black Tiger troops are planning to invade the town.
Malocchio and Gabrielle were also killed, by the same PCs. Dromir became the darklord of Invidia, while Curriculo and Karina became their own separate city-states. The Gundarakites drove out the Wolfweres, which went to war with the Gundarakites when Gabrielle's child was found out to actually be Ardonk Sezeria's. The Gundarakites now have their very own nation in northeast Invidia. Southern Invidia is currently ruled by Ogres, whom Darryl and Dromir taught agricultural techniques to so they would not have to raid nearby villages for food.