Café de Nuit

Hello brothers and sisters i require assistance.

I was in the mood to put my players in Ravenloft(havent played in more than a year) but as i read through it i realize more and more that it kinda want to be a victorian setting and it pretends it isnt (at least the western core) wich is fine if you plan to include most of the setting but i was thinking more in a Sherlock Holmes meets Supernatural kind of game.

I have the masques of the red death book for 3.5 ('couse im kind of an idiot that way) and was thinking in using it, i want to know what is usefull in the book what specificaly is wrong so that i can pach it, i want to use the book, ive had it gathering dust in my shelf for years now.

So, help?

(excuse my bad english, not a native speker)

(adendum: MotRD p38 "...who can take the shape of el tigre, the mighty and much respected jaguar..." :facepalm: )

So use the book?

Sorry mate, I'm just not 100% on what kind of help you're looking for?

Epically wrote:So use the book?

Sorry mate, I'm just not 100% on what kind of help you're looking for?

Mostly advice on turning Ravenloft into a more victorian setting, and what parts of the book are usefull and what i should avoid, i know it to be an infamous book

The book is great on flavor, IMHO. I think it's the rules that have been decried a lot, but I pretty much just skimmed them, since I didn't plan on running a MotRD game, so I don't know the specific issues. If you want a real victorian setting, I'd just use MotRD as a setting as is. Then, pick a ruleset you like and go with it, but don't feel shackled to the rules in the 3.5 book. (though, if you like them, use them and patch as needed). If you like bits and pieces of Ravenloft proper, go ahead and plop them into Gothic Earth.

Gonzoron of the FoS wrote:The book is great on flavor, IMHO. I think it's the rules that have been decried a lot, but I pretty much just skimmed them, since I didn't plan on running a MotRD game, so I don't know the specific issues.

I think the Red Death is great and have toyed with the idea of running it. I would probably lean on games like Cthulhu by Gaslight, The Kerberos Club, Victoriana or Clockwork & Chivalry to get a solid Victorian rules system that can be stretched to the Red Death setting. Those are just sytems that I'm familiar with. There are a host of other Victorian centered games that could work. Space 1889, Castle Falkenstein and Ghosts of Albion are supposed to be very good as well.

Not sure if this helps, but...

The Victorian Era that most people are familiar with is the Sherlock Holmes/Jack the Ripper era, but that was near the end of her (Queen Vic) like 70 year reign. The wiki link below gives a great overview of the many aspects of the age and may be helpful.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victorian_era

I also explained this to another GM friend of mine, since Ravenloft has always been magic poor and those driven to madness are usually granted their inventive desires (Mordenheim, anyone?). So while there is a small population, they are more driven. A simple way to put that, if there is a technology or innovation you want to put in, put it in.

Making the shift into the Victorian era isn't all that difficult for the core. Really one only needs to focus on a few major changes and then make logical social changes as they come. Personally I'd do this:

Transportation

Rail Network-
Major locations will have a train yard and minor locations will have just a track with a stop. Specific times only.

Carriage Network-
Treat carriages like buses going to and from major locations and minor locations. Specific times mostly.

Production

Factories-
Producing goods at a much lower rate and providing jobs to everyone, even very small children. Death rate high, pay rate low.

Students-
Medical Schooling and general education now available for the public(non-noble) for a noble price.

Science takes Religion

Popularity-
The masses are treated with vaccines by accomplished doctors and scientists: not prayers to a God that won't answer. Spellcasting clerics are as rare as the Paladin was. The Paladin is almost unheard of. The existence of deities is only certain in rural communities.

Plotting those changes out will allow things to begin shifting on their own; when you think of social change as an effect.

Also, don't overlook the d20 Past module for the d20 Modern rules system. It includes a Victorian-era variant (not Gothic Earth/Masque of the Red Death per se, but if I were to run the Masque setting in 3rd edition, I would use the d20 Past rules set).

I can't speak to DMing Masque of the Red Death, but I can say that I had a rare opportunity to play in the setting for a year-long campaign. It was a blast. The DM was very talented, and very knowledgeable of the Victorian era. In terms of flavor, it was great, and I have to say that the rules never interfered with our enjoyment of the game.

I realize this won't answer your question, per se, but perhaps it could alleviate some of your concerns about that book and the rules it offers!

A Victorian style setting will have to see the back of that D&D spell list - it just doesn't fit the concepts of magic of the time. Victorians had gypsy palm-readers and spirits coming over from the other side and perhaps even knew of curses and voodoo dolls, but they didn't think much of the idea of exploding a ball of fire on the spot like a grenade, or turning invisible by uttering mystical words.

Of course, the D&D system without the magic would be nothing short of attrocious. I'm using my own Polymorph system for Ravenloft as I find it a better fit. FATE Core or even the description system would be good, though of course for any option you're looking into creating new rules for Fear & Horror checks.

Come to think of it, there are quite a few things a Victorian setting could do with. 'Updated' rules on guns, carts and explosives would be good, as well as modernized medicine.

I had a lot of luck simply placing traditional Ravenloft adventures directly into the "real" world for Call of Cthulhu games. I particularly liked my experience with using Castle Ravenloft on a group of ethnographers and a World War 1 veteran. You find subtle changes as you work through the story. When an NPC Vistani (in this case, a little known ethnic group among European Romani) explained a little of Strahd's history, I made him a voivode who fought alongside Vlad Tepes before returning to his ancestral home.

I think you'll find that once you make a few base decisions, flavor starts to take care of itself. Think about placing "Hour of the Knife" in Paris. Or what if Azalin was actually a Roman ruler almost forgotten by history.

Ooh, I think I'm going to run with that one myself!

You won't even have to worry about toning done the fighting like I did for Call of Cthulhu. Though you might find the story flows a little better if you take out a lot of the high fantasy encounters and creatures.