Drakov and seige engines
Posted: Fri Sep 17, 2010 3:33 pm
We all know Drakov's take on gunpowder and magic, but what about seige engines like catapults and trebuchets? Would he use those?
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HuManBing wrote:I don't see why not.
There are reasons to distrust magic. Hell, most of the people in Ravenloft already do. Drakov may distrust magic out of a belief that it's unreliable and uncontrollable (vide Azalin's and Strahd's own curses for examples of this) and results in terrible consequences.
Gunpowder is similarly a very unstable new technology, and Drakov can't be faulted for being cautious about it.
But siege engines have been in use for centuries before the medieval period. Drakov would definitely have seen them in use on Taladas, where strongholds required such siege engines to crack open.
Sure, the Zulus won one famous battle- a Pyrrhic victory that cost a huge number of Zulu lives and was never to be repeated. Look at what happened to them after that!Manofevil wrote:A lot of the reasons you guys have raised were the reasons the Zulu beat the british regulars in Africa in very famous battle in the 19th Century. There were other contributing factors but those turned it into a massacre rather than a victory.
Well, the Zulus were also living in terrain ill-suited for cultivation of crops and raising a significant population. It's one thing to subdue a relatively small population of confederated hunter-gatherers and subsistence farmers with a campaign of decisive victories. (Vide immigrants vs. natives in the North American campaigns of the British and French.) As China has proven again and again throughout history, it's quite another thing to subjugate a massive population geometrically inflated through centuries of better cropland and centralized authority. In pre-Industrial history, it's been "conquered" twice by non-Han ethnicities - the Jin (Mongols) and the Qing (Manchus) and in each case, the invading culture largely assimilated with the Han majority within two generations.ewancummins wrote:Technology and tactics do matter, and military science may advance just as any other field of knowledge. The gap between Drakov's armies and some of his opponents is much smaller than what existed between the Zulus and the British, of course, but it is still significant. It tends to offset the advantages Falkovnia has in food production and a large population, IMO.
Of course, in any campaign where Drakov is hidebound and irrational, then pretty much everything I've written above is irrelevant. Sadly, this interpretation seems actually faintly feasible, given his bogeyman portrayal in canon materials. If you're more interested in a nuanced Drakov then his refusal to adopt gunpowder does not have to equate to battlefield inflexibility. Perhaps he has witnessed one too many torches in powder kegs, or a firing line ruined by rain, to feel safe with this new technology. In all other respects, he's a functionally savvy, intelligent military thinker.ewancummins wrote:It's almost as if Drakov's curse is to be unable to learn new military tactics, tools, strategies, etc- mirroring Azalin's curse of being unable to learn new spells.
The story has been stillborn for a while now, but I had considered something similar to this. Instead of an assassination, I was thinking of writing in a bit into his story where his own side sabotages an enemy cannon emplacement. The resulting explosion not only destroys the cannon but also collapses an entire wall of the enemy citadel, giving Drakov an easy victory... and a lifelong distrust of cannon. I've had to write in similar episodes explaining his distrust of demihumans and battlefield prejudice against women, too. These are convictions he holds strongly that deny him many useful advantages, but they're convictions that anybody who's been through what he's been through could understandably come out holding.ewancummins wrote:Maybe you should include a 'gunpowder plot' against Drakov in your novel? Something early in his reign, to make him paranoid about 'magic powder used by assassins.'
In my campaign (and as the novel is trying to demonstrate) Drakov is actually not so much crazy as war-shocked. Much of his attitude towards rulership derives from his childhood in a warzone, and he genuinely rules as best as he knows how. The tragedy of his situation is that he's a very effective leader in times of crisis, but he has never understood peacetime morality and so from a peaceful civilian viewpoint, he's a bloodthirsty firebrand. The only type of leadership he knows is crisis leadership, and therefore his inclination is toward continuing the crisis so he can be of use to his country. Historically, this draws from many realworld leaders, not least Mao Zedong ("The Revolution must continue at all costs!").It's irrational- but the dude is crazy.
If you mean the darklords are the ones used to such defenses, then I agree. The general populace is only vaguely aware of what closed domain borders are, often through the lens of folklore and secondhand accounts at best. If the darklord has some vested interest in keeping foes out, then such a defense is common. Of course, the only domain that borders Falkovnia that doesn't have a darklord terribly interested in the land per se is Lamordia, but it has its harsh, unforgiving terrain and weather to protect it.brilliantlight wrote:I tend to have Drakov has masses of soldiers explain why his domain hasn't been overrun myself. His neighbors are used to defending their domains using their various dark lord powers and are of the mindframe that "large armies are a waste of money because successful invasion is almost impossible." so none of them have huge armies and their troops are more police than soldiers.
Kessler wrote:My explanation for Drakov not using gunpowder is that warfare with gunpowder is completely different from medieval style warfare. To change from one style to another requires whole different mindset, strategy, tactic, equipment etc.
So for Drakov it is simply VERY big step to take and get adopted to warfare with immensely different style. He is simply not able to jump from one century to another, it took lots of generations on Earth... (on the other hand - Japanese got hold on it pretty quickly).
It's something like if medieval guy is transported to our time, he probably couldn't get used to our technologies and mindset.
So, anyway, Drakov using siege weapons is completely okay. However - medieval siege weapons are quite useless against gunpowder time defenses (low and fat walls).
Actually, in my campaign he is very adept tactician and commander - as long as he stays with bows and swords (after all, he was chief of very efficient mercenary group). He also tries to adopt into "new" world: the Ministry of Science is trying to invent all kinds of bizarre war machines that almost never work.
The neighbors Drakov invaded are Darkon(Undead), Lamordia(Adam summoned a vicious winter storm), Dementieu (Dominic mind controlled Drakov's officers), Richemulot (Jacqueline summoned hordes of rats), and Borca (poison). Evey one of which defeated partly by dark lord powers.HuManBing wrote:Against Azalin, Drakov's troops slaughtered the Darkonian soldiers and it was specifically the hordes of undead that drove him back out. It's Azalin's darklord power at work, but because undead do also roam independently of any darklord manifestation, it might not be immediately obvious that a darklord is doing this. Certainly Darkon's populace does not think of Azalin as an undead darklord, and Azalin is actually said to take great pains to hide his lich status. (If you adopt my personal canon that Drakov does know that Azalin is a lich, then things become very interesting - Drakov's desperate wars against Darkon might even seem a little tragic, as the doomed attempts to unseat an unspeakable evil, rather than the vainglorious campaigns of an irrational militant.)
Against Borca, Drakov's men were all poisoned via Boritsi's darklord power. However, because poison also is fairly subtle and ubiquitous outside of darklord powers, Drakov could be forgiven for not realizing a supernatural power was at work.
I do recall Drakov invading a gunpowder domain, which owes nothing to darklord powers.