Café de Nuit

Undead Cabbage wrote:Roti, should I post the stuff made on the Dopplers for the Zherisia gaz to give some heading? We already covered some aspects in Heirarchy, Niches, Physiology, and a few Salient Powers. What's made it in the final stamp?

Pretty much everything that was written for the Z-Gaz on doppelgangers made it into that book. This new project will expand upon that, and will also be useable for doppelganger-encounters set in domains other than Paridon.

Also, any chance I could write in the perspective of a certain *cough* 'hidden' NPC from the Zherisia Gaz? He'd certainly have quite a bit to say about the Dopplers.

Given the nature of the monsters in question, it'd be a cop-out if a few of the narrator's "sources" didn't turn out to be doppelgangers! OTOH, we don't want to overcomplicate the issue either, by having so many of these ringers that the reader loses track of them all. Maybe you could pm me about this 'hidden' NPC, and we'll work out the details?

While this thread doesn't have to be locked, I've started a new one on the Community Projects board in which people can call dibs on particular topics, and read a little more about how the netbook will be put together. Go check it out!

I hope you will address the various differing breeds of doppleganger:

dread doppleganger (Denizens of Dread)
outlander doppleganger (Monster Manual)
outlander doppleganger, greater (Monsters of Faerun)
ethereal doppleganger (Monster Manual II)

Chris Nichols

The dread doppelganger is the "default" version of the monster in the Land of Mists, so that's the version which will be covered the most thoroughly. They're natives of Zherisia and have their own society.

Outlander-doppelgangers (i.e. the MM version) tend to lose out to their Zherisian/dread counterparts in the Land of Mists, but they will rate a few mentions and are similar enough that most of what applies to the dread versions will work for them IYC as well. One long-forgotten name from the early game-products will also turn up in a Dread Possibility.

Greater doppelgangers don't really fit the motif of the other dopps, being too powerful, too solitary, and too willing to risk hands-on conflict with their enemies (i.e. they're not cowards at heart). There's been at least one greater doppelganger in the Land of Mists -- in fact, I know exactly what Sodo did to this potential competitor -- but they aren't a part of RL doppelganger society and will, at most, get a minor subheading (like night hags or demiliches received in the VRGtWitches and VRGttL, respectively).

Ethereal doppelgangers, I'm still thinking about. Expect to see a token appearance by them, but not necessarily with the same backstory as in the MMII.

The possibility of MMIII-style changelings -- suitably "Gothicized" and de-Eberronized, I promise! -- will also be addressed in passing, although a full treatment of those is best saved for a possible "Races of the Mists" QtR article. Essentially, they'd be the doppelgangers' versions of calibans, and will be 100% optional additions to a Ravenloft campaign.

I'd stick mainly to dread doppelgangers, and eventually give alternate abilities to make sure PCs are never really sure to be prepared...
After all, more or less any critter in RL has options to choose from, and the very shapechanging race should be just the same every time?

I subscribe for the DM appendix, possibly not alone, as I have some problem writing long and structured paragraphs in English

This looks AWESOME.

I haven't done enough Paridon stuff to really be able to contribute, but I'd be happy to help with proofing and editing. I have a good eye for typos and grammar.

The more, the merrier!

But if Dominique is good at editing and grammer, and Sorti needs a little help with English text, perhaps the two of you could work on something together? Not knowing much about Paridon doesn't have to be an issue, because some things -- like the DM advice in the appendix, or the chapter on unique abilities -- should be useful in non-Ravenloft games, too.

What, no salient abilities?

It looks pretty good, guys! I'm duly impressed.

Salients are included under "Individualized Abilities", Rucht. I'd also like to put any new racial feats in that chapter, along with some information on the classes they favor and ways they can take advantage of replaced victims' wealth and influence.


Any ideas for salient abilities you'd like to pass on there, Rucht? Love to hear 'em, if you do!

Rotipher of the FoS wrote:The more, the merrier!

But if Dominique is good at editing and grammer, and Sorti needs a little help with English text, perhaps the two of you could work on something together? Not knowing much about Paridon doesn't have to be an issue, because some things -- like the DM advice in the appendix, or the chapter on unique abilities -- should be useful in non-Ravenloft games, too.

BRILLIANT!

Dominique wrote:

Rotipher of the FoS wrote:The more, the merrier!

But if Dominique is good at editing and grammer, and Sorti needs a little help with English text, perhaps the two of you could work on something together? Not knowing much about Paridon doesn't have to be an issue, because some things -- like the DM advice in the appendix, or the chapter on unique abilities -- should be useful in non-Ravenloft games, too.

BRILLIANT!

Cool! I'm in . Now I understand what they mean when they say "To be a manager you have to get your people to work together"...

BTW, should we add some sample doppelganger NPC, sample hideout, sample short adventure and so on in the DM's appendix?

Someone else has already volunteered to contribute a "signature villain" doppelganger, but an additional NPC or two might be useful. Perhaps a human NPC who's studied doppelgangers and/or specializes in hunting them? A lone survivor from the Philosophy of Mankind massacre in SotK -- maybe human, maybe a change-crippled doppelganger that the PoM clerics had brainwashed into thinking it's human -- could also be interesting.

If you would like to design a sample adventure, that's fine. A hideout is also a good idea, although it might look better in the in-character text than in the DM section. "Rookhausen" could have visited a house which doppelgangers had taken over, then abandoned, and mapped and taken notes on the kinds of modifications they'd made, supplies they'd stocked (like a whole lot of changes of clothing ), etc.

Let me know via pm what you come up with, okay? Anything that will be helpful for DMs is appropriate, especially if it fosters paranoia among the players and PCs.

Rotipher of the FoS wrote:Someone else has already volunteered to contribute a "signature villain" doppelganger, but an additional NPC or two might be useful. Perhaps a human NPC who's studied doppelgangers and/or specializes in hunting them? A lone survivor from the Philosophy of Mankind massacre in SotK -- maybe human, maybe a change-crippled doppelganger that the PoM clerics had brainwashed into thinking it's human -- could also be interesting.

Wasn't there an article in one of the early BoS mentioning a private journal of a scholar Paridoner lady, intermittedly interrupted by the scribbles of some mysterious gentleman rambling about having to stay "in control"? I think it was a doppelganger with a mental disorder. The article was by Stuart Turner, I think.

Checked it, its in the Book of Sorrows. The article, A Kargatane Bookshelf, is a compilation of winner entries of the 1998 Kargatane contest. The entry I referred to is the The Fall of Lady Owen, by Marco A. Torres.

Rotipher of the FoS wrote:Someone else has already volunteered to contribute a "signature villain" doppelganger, but an additional NPC or two might be useful. Perhaps a human NPC who's studied doppelgangers and/or specializes in hunting them? A lone survivor from the Philosophy of Mankind massacre in SotK -- maybe human, maybe a change-crippled doppelganger that the PoM clerics had brainwashed into thinking it's human -- could also be interesting.

Will you include the Doppleganger-PCs in Darkon adventure idea?

Also will there be mention/use of the PrCs from the WOtC books which would fit for dopplegangers? For example Mindspy from Complete Warrior. Perhaps similar to the articles about how to use certain PrC for RL.