The War in the Core

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thekristhomas
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Re: The War in the Core

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Thought about this for a post war setup, it's rough and I haven't done all the border changes yet
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Re: The War in the Core

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thekristhomas wrote:Had another thought (well, an extension of an earlier thought really) on Malken's motivation with regards the Tepestian conquest.

I imagine it might be a point of pride for Tristen Hiregaard that he is regarded as a hero in Tepest. Sure, he is thought of very highly in Nova Vaasa, but in his home nation he is aware that all his good works do not compare to the evil he does while he is Malken. Kelee, on the other hand lies over the border, where Malken cannot touch it, and as the elderly Tristen nears death, he takes some small comfort in knowing that the good that he did for the people of Tepest will never be despoiled by his evil alter-ego.

That doesn't sit well with Malken, the prayers of the population of Kelee sting him, not from any power inherent to them, but merely because he is aware of them, but he has a plan. There was talk of a road to Darkon through Tepest even before the tortuous Strygoi Road was opened, and Malken encouraged it. Something of a speculation bubble was formed as Malken's agents spread rumors of the profits to be made. His criminal network began purchasing the debts of any investors in the plan so that he could apply pressure when needed. Pushing the country to war became a simple matter once most of the Five Families were heavily invested.

He might have been a little surprised by the calls for government action from representatives of the lower classes, the speculation bubble having spread passed it's normal bounds, luring in those who could ill afford to lose. In fact, small collectives of shopkeepers and merchants had been formed for the purpose of investing in the Tepestian Road, and it was with a combination of annoyance and amusement that Malken discovered that even some of those who had been paid to spread false positive rumors were also investing. None of this ran contrary to Malken's plan for Tepest though, so he paid it little mind.

Malken's victory over Tristen will be complete when Othmar puts Tristen in charge of the invasion force, because Tristen will know that he will not be able to cross the border, and therefore the horrors that follow will be done in his name and he will be unable to stop them. I'm thinking that this would be a good place for Tristen to die and the curse move to Stepan, particularly if Tristen was hoping that Stepan could lead in his stead. For myself, and you might disagree on this, I would quite like Malken to leave Tristen a little while before Tristen dies, enough time for them to have a face to face conversation. Tristen would have a moment of feeling free of him, and then Malken would explain how he had pushed the country to war just to spoil Tristen's memory in Kelee and the rest of Tepest, and how he would now spend a lifetime tormenting Tristen's own grandchild, and through him the rest of Tristen's family, and how Othmar, to whom Tristen had remained loyal, was nothing but a depraved pawn of Malken's the whole time.

Malken seems to think he has completely defeated Tristen, and he has, but in doing so he has unleashed forces that he cannot (or at least fails to control) Othmar's success in Tepest makes him think he is a great military leader who no longer needs to listen to Malken, and invades Barovia. Those investment collectives quickly become a political force once the Tepestian campaign is over and the road still fails to be built. To top it off Stepan Hiregaard is a young, vigorous lawman, who, it should be pointed out, grew up in Nova Vaasa (unlike Sir Tristen, or indeed Malken) and knows it's ways.

I imagine that the revolution that follows the Barovian war could see a complete dismantling of Malken's power base, from top to bottom. He will choose to eliminate Othmar himself, but the shift in power that follows this could see most of Malken's agents useless if not dead. Stepan's hounding should see to a large proportion of the rest, as one could easily see anti-corruption/organised crime to be a priority of the new regime.

Malken then, would be left, to some extent, as we first found him, an enraged serial killer trapped in the body of the lawman hunting him, his victory over Tristen seeming hollow but compelled to do the same.
I think (YMMV), that this resolves the question of Malken's curse. It has been pointed out several times that Malken is the DL and Tristen is the curse, but it always seems like Tristen is the one being tortured.

For myself, I have come to view Malken's curse as the need to torture Tristen, even though he is torturing himself. Not just literally, of course, Malken and Tristen are the same person after all, but also that Malken will pursue "victory" over Tristen even when it harms his interests. The Tepestian "endgame" is then an ultimate expression of this, Malken will take his country to war, which will destroy his country and his power base (Malken is heavily invested in the status quo) just to destroy the old man's small comfort
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Re: The War in the Core

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thekristhomas wrote:
thekristhomas wrote:Had another thought (well, an extension of an earlier thought really) on Malken's motivation with regards the Tepestian conquest.

I imagine it might be a point of pride for Tristen Hiregaard that he is regarded as a hero in Tepest. Sure, he is thought of very highly in Nova Vaasa, but in his home nation he is aware that all his good works do not compare to the evil he does while he is Malken. Kelee, on the other hand lies over the border, where Malken cannot touch it, and as the elderly Tristen nears death, he takes some small comfort in knowing that the good that he did for the people of Tepest will never be despoiled by his evil alter-ego.

That doesn't sit well with Malken, the prayers of the population of Kelee sting him, not from any power inherent to them, but merely because he is aware of them, but he has a plan. There was talk of a road to Darkon through Tepest even before the tortuous Strygoi Road was opened, and Malken encouraged it. Something of a speculation bubble was formed as Malken's agents spread rumors of the profits to be made. His criminal network began purchasing the debts of any investors in the plan so that he could apply pressure when needed. Pushing the country to war became a simple matter once most of the Five Families were heavily invested.

He might have been a little surprised by the calls for government action from representatives of the lower classes, the speculation bubble having spread passed it's normal bounds, luring in those who could ill afford to lose. In fact, small collectives of shopkeepers and merchants had been formed for the purpose of investing in the Tepestian Road, and it was with a combination of annoyance and amusement that Malken discovered that even some of those who had been paid to spread false positive rumors were also investing. None of this ran contrary to Malken's plan for Tepest though, so he paid it little mind.

Malken's victory over Tristen will be complete when Othmar puts Tristen in charge of the invasion force, because Tristen will know that he will not be able to cross the border, and therefore the horrors that follow will be done in his name and he will be unable to stop them. I'm thinking that this would be a good place for Tristen to die and the curse move to Stepan, particularly if Tristen was hoping that Stepan could lead in his stead. For myself, and you might disagree on this, I would quite like Malken to leave Tristen a little while before Tristen dies, enough time for them to have a face to face conversation. Tristen would have a moment of feeling free of him, and then Malken would explain how he had pushed the country to war just to spoil Tristen's memory in Kelee and the rest of Tepest, and how he would now spend a lifetime tormenting Tristen's own grandchild, and through him the rest of Tristen's family, and how Othmar, to whom Tristen had remained loyal, was nothing but a depraved pawn of Malken's the whole time.

Malken seems to think he has completely defeated Tristen, and he has, but in doing so he has unleashed forces that he cannot (or at least fails to control) Othmar's success in Tepest makes him think he is a great military leader who no longer needs to listen to Malken, and invades Barovia. Those investment collectives quickly become a political force once the Tepestian campaign is over and the road still fails to be built. To top it off Stepan Hiregaard is a young, vigorous lawman, who, it should be pointed out, grew up in Nova Vaasa (unlike Sir Tristen, or indeed Malken) and knows it's ways.

I imagine that the revolution that follows the Barovian war could see a complete dismantling of Malken's power base, from top to bottom. He will choose to eliminate Othmar himself, but the shift in power that follows this could see most of Malken's agents useless if not dead. Stepan's hounding should see to a large proportion of the rest, as one could easily see anti-corruption/organised crime to be a priority of the new regime.

Malken then, would be left, to some extent, as we first found him, an enraged serial killer trapped in the body of the lawman hunting him, his victory over Tristen seeming hollow but compelled to do the same.
I think (YMMV), that this resolves the question of Malken's curse. It has been pointed out several times that Malken is the DL and Tristen is the curse, but it always seems like Tristen is the one being tortured.

For myself, I have come to view Malken's curse as the need to torture Tristen, even though he is torturing himself. Not just literally, of course, Malken and Tristen are the same person after all, but also that Malken will pursue "victory" over Tristen even when it harms his interests. The Tepestian "endgame" is then an ultimate expression of this, Malken will take his country to war, which will destroy his country and his power base (Malken is heavily invested in the status quo) just to destroy the old man's small comfort
I get that this seems to contradict earlier discussion of Malken's attitude vis-a-vis war in general, but for myself I think we can confine those sentiments to being relevant only to the possible war with Hazlan over the disobedience of the Pave there. After all, a conflict with Hazlan interrupts the flow of opium, to no real benefit to him, the specifics of Lawgiver dogma are of little concern.
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Re: The War in the Core

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DustBunny wrote:
thekristhomas wrote:A big part of me wants this to be a spectacular victory for Strahd though, where there would actually be some kind of benefit to him for having these "vassal" darklords.
This is where we diverge. :mrgreen:

IMNSHO Strahd (and other popular Darklords) have been pampered waaaaay too much in the canon and need to be taken down a peg or three. Not so that PC's can beat them, but to make their life a misery showing that can indeed lose more than they think they have lost by their curse.

The whole Tatyana thing keeps coming across as a minor nuisance that occurs between Strahd straddling Ravenloft and beating his chest after smiting yet another group of powerful foes and accumulating even more power. It is degrading the impact like Azalins 'no more spells' curse where he keeps getting retrofitted with new spells as the plot demands.

A war can shake things up a bit, so is a good opportunity to remove said pegs.
My thoughts on Darklord success at the moment are, if the success doesn't bring the darklord to any of their "true" goals, and if it binds them closer to the land, then the DPs might allow it. Strahd defeating the usurpers and enslaving them somehow doesn't bring him any closer to Tatyana or escape, neither does the annexation of Borca, neither did the annexation of Gundarak.
I prefer to have them think they are about to obtain their goal/espcape their curse and then have the victory turn to ash in their mouths, not just maintain the status quo.

Dark Powers: The *snigger* 'Lords' are moaning about how they are suffering? We haven't even stared... *cracks knuckles*

Eg: Strahd gets a genuine opportunity to get Tat's, _but_ it requires a major sacrifice. The chance comes when he is involved in a critical phase of an enemy enroaching on Barovia. He can either chase her or lose a bit of Barovia forever. If he goes for Tat's he loses that bit of Barovia, but then finds out she is in that region, now forever out of his reach due to his obsession instead of looking at the big picture. If he defends the land, he loses her by not jumping at the opportunity. Heads the DP's win, tails Strahd loses. He will be tormenting himself with endless 'What ifs" for years and his ego takes a major beating.

Mind you, it is your war so ignore me if I'm too far off track. :wink:
I've definitely come around to this way of thinking recently, and I think that his "victory" should result in the entrapment of the wannabe darklords within their pocket domains, but also that Strahd himself be confined to within the ring of choking fog, a la the original adventure. Strahd's conquests stretched and strained at his prison walls until they snapped back into an even smaller cell.

Given that, I'm more certain that I would want the finale to be less Castle Ravenloft-centric, but am really struggling to come up with any alternatives that feel as emotionally satisfying, any ideas?
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Re: The War in the Core

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ewancummins wrote:
thekristhomas wrote:
jamesfirecat wrote: The other possibility of course is that Jacques may end up doing something that Jacqueline should have at least considered doing a long time ago, and end up being lucky enough to find that somewhere in the Drakov line/among the other acceptable Falkovnian brides to be there is a female Natural Wererat...
Now this has to be a possibility, right? the Silver Scourge (or whatever it was called) definitely didn't get all the natural wererats in Falkovnia, and I can't imagine all the remaining ones fleeing to the newly formed Richemulot.

If we assume that those few left behind were the infirm, and the elderly, that might lead to some interesting characterizations for following generations. Falkovnian wererats have been living in different circumstances than their pampered kin, and if they derive from diseased stock there might be some interesting variations. Culturally there may be differences too, which might lead to snobbery towards them.

An interesting idea might be for a female Falkovnian wererat to distinguish herself amongst the Falkovnian populace, thus making her a suitable mate for Jacques, as far as a political match goes, but entirely unsuitable on a more social level

You killed Ignatz. He was my brother. You killed my brother!

<Hefts maces and moves to attack>
I can't believe it's taken me this long to get this reference :lol:
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Re: The War in the Core

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:renier:

Good times!
Delight is to him- a far, far upward, and inward delight- who against the proud gods and commodores of this earth, ever stands forth his own inexorable self.

-from Moby Dick (Hermann Melville)
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