Opinion on campaign Undead Empire idea...

[Cantheist]

I was thinking of an element for a campaign from a book called "The Risen Empire". I'm actually thinking of a Gothic Undead Rome.

An ancient kingdom that is ruled over by Undead, whose greatest reward for the common "John Q. Mortal" (being mortal is considered being a commoner) citizen is achieving enough skill, power, money or recognition to be nominated to join the ranks of undead "Immortals" and have a place in ruling over the kingdom or passing the years away in the exclusive Enclaves where only the "Immortals" are allowed to go and do what they do.

At the head of the government is the "Immortal King/Emperor" who is a semi-religious figure and the political Senate. Being in the Senate is an almost guaranteed way to be be choosen to become an "Immortal". For the most part the Senate runs the functions of government. They control the Army and courts and collect the taxes and have roads maintained. The Kings only two powers is the power to Veto whatever and nominate people to "Immortal" status.

For the most part the common person in the Empire will never see an "Immortal" as the class division is segregated. Those "Immortals" who have direct contact with commoners lead the Merchant Guilds, Generals in the Army so essentially are the Bosses Boss.

There is a number of people in the Empire that have the belief in a natural death. That death is a part of life and that by dying pass on there places to the next generation so that the people will prosper and innovate. Several Senators have actually rejected the offer of "Immortality" and have died natural deaths though. The "Immortals" tolerate this segment of the population as the majority of citizens sees the power and influence and resources of the "Immortals" in it's practicality rather than vague ideals of a few philosophical idealists.

The religions of the kingdom are numerous but all of them are somewhat grim and macabre. The people revere the "Immortals" and the dead to a high degree. An ancestor who is an "Immortal" gives the family influence. Another high honor is if a Hero who was worthy of "Immortality" was killed or died in serving the kingdom. It's the most honorable form of loyalty.

The world compromises and area of land geographically simuliar of the regions of western europe, north africa, the mediterranean region and western asia kinda mishmashed together. The Empire has several neighbors in the world. In the north are "barbarians" which compromise everything from numerouis small city-states to tribes and clans. To the south are the Mohmadi that are lead by a an ancient vampire Kalif, who the commoners believe to be a barbaric foriegn sorcerous warlord but the "Immortals" know to be a very old Vampire (they hate each other). To the east is another kingdom that had actually split from the Empire a thousand years ago. It's ruled by an "Immortal" that is said to be a relative of the "Immortal King" but such talk in public will get you hung by the Empires many Sedition laws.

I was also thinking of an Elven knigdom in the south east that would have a kind of asian feel to it with a bit Tolkein too and so as to be a contrast to the Empires "Immortals" by having the Elves naturally not die from simply aging. But am unsure.

I want this to be a Horror campaign. But for the most part people will be comfortable about the notions of undead and vampires. There will be Vampire Lords of course and zombie hordes but I want the Horror aspect to be filled (taking the place of the Vamps and ghouls) by Abberations. I'm thinking of prodigious use of mind flayers and other abberations to give a Lovecraftian spin to the Undead kingdoms. I think an Undead General leading an army against an aberrant stronghold would be very interesting.

[Boccaccio Barbarossa]

I have always wanted to play in a game set ni an ancient Rome. I know I romanticize it, but I think it would rock. (i even think that a good idea for the feel of Darkon is to make it Bysantine, like the inheritors of Rome and Classical culture, with the backwaters being like conquered and forgotten lands...)

If I were to say anything, though, is that I would NOT have the population know about the specifics of undeth. Essentially, imagine if the Emperor is an Ancient Dead or other similar creature but that he frames his longevity as "having the favour of the gods". he would likely, like the historical Emperors, presernt himself as a living god, able to give his blessing and revoke it at will. (The possibility of having a large section of the aristocracy and military command under the quasi-mind control makes for great networks but it also suggests that there may be political rivals which people keep trying to eliminate but fail... And even plots against the emperor by underlings with the hopes of being free of his rule...) of course, it's perfectly acceptable for one undead ruller to tell his people that, while they are benificient rulers who have the favour of the gods, the others are gross undead horros!

IN that way, peasants and populace might have to ritualistically make sacrifices at various times in the year in order to keep the gods looking favourably upon the ruler. (And if he ever dies, the next leader can simply state that he has fallen out of favour.) Some of these victims may be to feed the lord or his undead minons who need flesh, blod, souls, whatever, and some of the others may be transformed to serve as war leaders, etc. And of course, somehow, the kingdom never seems to run out of soldiers... Maybe you could have some of these generals and officies require the wearing of masks. That way, you could never know the face behind the mask of office and you can put anyone living OR dead in that role...

One of the reason for keeping it all secret is that part of the horror comes from the slow discovery of the extent of the control that these monsters have. So, your PCs serve in the army. They discover their marshal is undead. They find a way to destroy them. He is replaced, they get commendations (because the state needs to keep up appearances.) 2 months later, howeevr, they are sent to the front, in the most violent region... They win great victories, rather than dying as they should. They discover assassins at every turn...l only to trace these back to senator or praetor Lucius Gaius Caecilius Romanus, who is, it appears, the right hand man to the emperor.

more investigating reveals, however, that this senator is at the head of a secret mystery cult devoted to some god or other and that he believes the emperior has lost favour with the gods. So he tries to convince the PCs to help. (of course, they don;t know that the emperor is himself an undead mastermind...)

They either do or betray him... the adventures continue! (Wow! I've hyped myself up so much on this idea... damn I wish I had the time to lash this together for my playeras... Or better: that I could convince them to get it together for ME to play in! )

[Cantheist]

The thing is they don't know that the "Immortals" are "undead". They don't know that you have to die to unlive forever...

[taintedsoul]

I am not sure if this helps, but I have run a campaign in a domain that was simular to ancient Rome. The Darklord was an emporor modeled after the mad emperors of Rome. When his madness became too much to bear the people turned against him and executed him publicly, cutting him in such a way that he slowly bled to death. They then burned the body.

As he died he swore revenge, and as the mists rolled in he rose as a crimson death. That night the capital city caught fire and riots filled the streets. The great city was destroyed. Those who did not abandon the city soon fell victim to their former master.

The city now lays abandoned, forsaken by the residents of the land. The lord still prowls the night hunting for those who might walk his city. He sees the land, now only a fraction of its size and greatness and weeps. He longs for the days of greatness and decadence but is powerless to lead his people. While he longs to rule, his hatred for the people of his land will never allow it.

He sees his people as weak, ruled not by a single strong leader but by a senate, and devided into two smaller 'nations', one a people of philosophy and art, the other a people of the sea.

Anyway, like I said I am not sure this helps, but maybe you can get some ideas from it...

[Shoon VII]

Cantheist,

i think you have the basis for a wonderful and memorable campaign with these ideas.

i'm not sure what you're looking for though; are you just sharing your material so that we can gain inspiration and gaming material for our respective games OR are you looking for suggestions/ideas/etc?

i think the value of the undead in a game is the familiarity they with the human experience and yet their inability to empathize any longer with the rest of humanity. even those undead that coexist as "shadow" entities in RL society are never truly a part of the cultures they prey upon. making the common folk comfortable with the undead, while not impossible, would require (in my mind) a comsmology somewhat along the lines of certain precolumbian civilizations like those found in the Andes highlands and in Mexico before 1500 BCE.

the idea of rome is ripe for appropriation in a campaign; you could model your campiagn after the republic era or the era of empire. even within these two epochs there was a lot of variation and stories to tell.

[Shoon VII]

another thought,

i come from the school of thought that believes "less is more" in horror movies. making massive amounts of anthing (undead or aberrations) could take some of the mystery out of deciphering the nature of the beast.

[Cantheist]

I'm essentially trading Necromancers and Vampires for Alienists and Mindflayers.

[Samael Hands of Stone]

another thought,

i come from the school of thought that believes "less is more" in horror movies. making massive amounts of anthing (undead or aberrations) could take some of the mystery out of deciphering the nature of the beast.

Shoon VII my man, it does me a great deal of good to know that there are other like me out there. You post basically sums up everything I believe storytelling, rpg-ing and art in general should be about.

You got my respect, and I look forward to exchanging ideas with you on this board in the future.

[Boccaccio Barbarossa]

The thing is they don't know that the "Immortals" are "undead". They don't know that you have to die to unlive forever...

Oh... I guess I missed that!

But yeah - you definitely have a very sound basis for a campaign in what you've described thus far. And I have to agree as well with both Jason Am(brus) and Shoon VII with this: less is definitely more in the long run. (though I personally, really like the idea of a "divine emperor").

(although, secretly, I think I may just be in love with the roman armour, the shields and the gladius.

[Shoon VII]

(though I personally, really like the idea of a "divine emperor")

as do i. a vampire masquerading as a divine emperor sounds cool. you've just made me shift my entire conception of Darkon.

yeah!

[Boccaccio Barbarossa]

(though I personally, really like the idea of a "divine emperor")

as do i. a vampire masquerading as a divine emperor sounds cool. you've just made me shift my entire conception of Darkon.

yeah!

I've always felt that was the way to go, I think. Well, maybe not always, but my present ravenloft sensibilities are alwyas to try and find a way that that local populace might explain away ceertain things like "undead kings". And , the fact that Azalin's title is "Rex" from the latin for ruler or king... well, it's always made me want to put a Byzantine Empire/Old Roman touch to some of the parts of the real at least...

Which is why the whole Necropolis thing has ALWAYS agravated me: it used to be Il Aluk was to me a sort of little Rome, one of the biggest cities with the University of Il Aluk being a center for learning. Though, even the name, Necropolis - Greek for city of the dead... It can still work, I guess.

[Shoon VII]

Which is why the whole Necropolis thing has ALWAYS agravated me: it used to be Il Aluk was to me a sort of little Rome, one of the biggest cities with the University of Il Aluk being a center for learning. Though, even the name, Necropolis - Greek for city of the dead... It can still work, I guess.

you know ... feel free to change it back to Il Aluk and restructure the Requiem disaster for your campaign.

i would.

[Boccaccio Barbarossa]

Which is why the whole Necropolis thing has ALWAYS agravated me: it used to be Il Aluk was to me a sort of little Rome, one of the biggest cities with the University of Il Aluk being a center for learning. Though, even the name, Necropolis - Greek for city of the dead... It can still work, I guess.

you know ... feel free to change it back to Il Aluk and restructure the Requiem disaster for your campaign.

i would.

yeah - but I'm not running the game, and it's not that major of a concern for the present game, anyways... and we sort of play it as the decadent, crumbling empire... the word "necropolis' , in fact, has only entered our game once and that was when we were in some crypts... and underground necropolis. and it wasn;t even ravenloft. lol!

[Drinnik Shoehorn]

Try and get a copy of Die, Vecna, Die!

The way the Undead are represented in Cavitus is similar to your idea.