One World Ravenloft

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Five
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One World Ravenloft

Post by Five »

I'm not sure if this has been an exhausted topic on these boards or not (I'm too lazy to check right now to be perfectly honest with you), but has anybody out there played with the idea of unifying Ravenloft into a singular/constant world with a singular/constant history?

For example, using the Timeline of Events (any edition) as not necessarily indicative of having the domain appear, but to have the current domain (its rulership) established. Essentially using the current timeline to format the current domains and rulers, thus excluding the domains they were spun off from, seized from, etc.

Granted it's a complicated task (keeping each current domain ruler's background "canon"), but if you broke it down and stuck to a domain's individual timeline I think it could work. You'd need to break canon for some of the domains, no doubt, but the separation from other game settings would in no way hurt the Ravenloft we've all come to love. In fact, I believe it would serve to gel it into something...more.

And once that is done then you could backfill a ton of stuff. Ruins dating back older than the current dark lords, (that they may not yet fully be aware of!), independent legends and lore (ie: classical/mythic monsters for the PCs to combat, potential/occasional partnerships or headaches for the current dark lords; the esoteric reasons/myths/beliefs behind RL's "deicide" even!; a veritable greenhouse for the DM to greenthumb), a richer cast of folk that populates the domain (more bloodlines for the DM to weave in and around the current domains, more choices for the PCs to choose from)...the possibilities are endless.

This idea will or might not be for those who like to cling on to printed Ravenloft (Monday to Wednesday I'm a Black Boxer :wink: ), but for those who don't mind tinkering with material to canonise their own ideas? It might be an interesting topic for discussion.

Anyone?
"A very piteous thing it was to see such a quantity of dead bodies, and such an outpouring of blood - that is, if they had not been enemies of the Christian faith."

- Jean Pierre Sarrasin, "The Memoirs of the Lord of Joinville"
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Re: One World Ravenloft

Post by Five »

For example, let's take Darkon. Given its landmass, and given the fact that Azalin is the only current ruler of the Core that legitimately wears a crown (as far as I can recall), I imagine that at some point during its history (Classical?) it assimilated several cultures (domains), similar to real world Rome.

So, the question remains: who were the victims of these wars? Who were those that willingly (coerced or not) chose to be ruled?

Did old Darkon backwater the elves of RL to Sithicus?

Who else could they have driven to near-extinction?

Is the current dwarven population descended from the refugees of a cataclysmic event? Bluetspur? Arak?

Are there any of the affected bloodlines currently plotting (very, very secretly!) insurrection? A "return to the old ways"?

What was this relation to Azalin like? A warrior or tactical genius of such calibre (ala Alexander the Great) that would have Vlad Drakov himself saluting his fanboy respect? And speaking of which, could Falkovnia be the result of an annexed land, treacherously taken by Azalin's former general (mercenary or appointed)?
"A very piteous thing it was to see such a quantity of dead bodies, and such an outpouring of blood - that is, if they had not been enemies of the Christian faith."

- Jean Pierre Sarrasin, "The Memoirs of the Lord of Joinville"
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Re: One World Ravenloft

Post by Mistmaster »

Have you checked my Mistworld topics? I tried to do exactly that.
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Re: One World Ravenloft

Post by Five »

I will be reading it shortly. Thanks.

http://www.fraternityofshadows.com/foru ... mistworlds

Is this the thread?

For those who may want to re-read/re-thread...

Two things scream at me right off the hop.

First, the populations are extremely heavy-handed. It's not that I can't work with it/around it, just that I noticed. Minor detail.

Second, Light Lords. I like the concept in a storyline sense, but my initial thoughts are that they take away from the PC's accomplishments and overall function or, purpose (who are oftentimes thrust into that role, willing or not). In a mythic/Highlander/cosmic minimalist kind of way, sure. In a gothic/joe versus Evil/against all odds kind of way, not so much. But that's just my opinion.

I'll think and read some more though. Every thought/idea has a seed that can be nurtured...:)
"A very piteous thing it was to see such a quantity of dead bodies, and such an outpouring of blood - that is, if they had not been enemies of the Christian faith."

- Jean Pierre Sarrasin, "The Memoirs of the Lord of Joinville"
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Re: One World Ravenloft

Post by Mistmaster »

Thanks for reading it;
On your observations, population is way hiter than canon, and that was done on purpose; I increased overall dimensions, and I wanted it to be in line with my concept; The mistworld is a real world, with real people in it; the demografy is in line with that of Late-medieval Europe, more or less.

About Lightlords; it's a fixation of mine; I do have a sort of simmetric compulsion; plus, this way I can reasonably play my Mistpowers (Darkpowers) as true neutral, because they didn't left countless numbers of people to suffer under the yoke of mercyless monsters, but they created a balance of sort. You can easily scratch them off or downplay them if they do not work for you.
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Re: One World Ravenloft

Post by Chaot »

I wouldn't worry too much about creating a timeline that holds hard and fast. Remember that Ravenloft doesn't work like the real world. Realms pop into and out of existence. People living there have an idea of other domains and trade between them. They also know that traveling from domain to domain is dangerous.

I harken back to the writings of Michael Moorcock on this. In his Elric books he had a character, Aubeck of Malador, who carved out a nation from the very stuff of Chaos. Once it was created, the land had existed from the founding of the world. He basically rewrote history. I feel this theme is highly present in Ravenloft, even coming from much of the published materials.
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Re: One World Ravenloft

Post by Mistmaster »

Yes and that is exactly what I think the author of the thread wants ti chabge. (At the very least is what I want)
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Re: One World Ravenloft

Post by Five »

Mistmaster is right: my purpose of this thread is to fish ideas in an effort to convert Ravenloft into a real world, or, a world that is self-contained. Well, as real/self-contained as any other D&D setting.

By my estimation Ravenloft is now established enough through long campaigning (literally), fan work and platforming of new ideas such as that produced and enabled by this site, and in no small part by the vision and execution of 3E (as stated in the "Changes Wrought" blurb in RLCS, with particular emphasis on "internally consistent") that it no longer needs the Mists to act as some sort of eclectic Earthworks project manager.

The Mists as a means of otherworldly transportation (seemingly or personally) is fine in and of it itself, but the idea of using it to lure gamers from other settings (cross-promotion/sales/etc) serves no purpose other than to eternalise its dependence on those said settings. It should and can be dependent on rules systems (which it possesses with the Powers Check, Fear, and Horror rules), themes (gothic/gothic-inspired fantasy horror), and nothing else. IMO. There is nothing inherently wrong with the Mists snatching land and claiming it their own (it's an easy "in" for DMs, familiar territory for devote/stubborn players of other settings, and a nice tidy temporary adventure setup/weekend in hell for the PCs of those other settings), but the lands being subtly "terraformed" (spiritually/emotionally/thematically/etc) by its dark lord's taint, combined with personal ambition, geopolitics, along with Mistic ( :wink: ) personal transportation/relocation is or, should be, more than enough flavour in and of itself to highlight Ravenloft as being a unique setting. The Mists parting to reveal a DM's (YOUR) homebrewed domain, thus maintaining that aforementioned internal consistency, should by and large be the extent of it. Again, IMO. The land grab, a sidenote DM's option or delegation to random/"floating" pocket domains. Not as the in-game formation/history of the world.

In short, it's not that I'm pissing on others' game ways or what not: I'm not. Like I said, I'm a Black Box holdout for the most part. I love, and have always loved, the open-endedness to that edition of the setting; how it teased the imagination moreso than painted a picture; how it seemed to be a written invitation for the reader to inject their creations and make that horror their own. But, I do love to tinker on my "off days". And I like to tinker with the help of minds like that of those posters that visit these forums.

This is a call-out for anybody who may have ideas (big, small, fragmented - don't matter) on how to detach Ravenloft from its TSR/shared world umbilical cord. Like Mistmaster's Mistworld.

I just want to see what Ravenloft could look like standing on its own two feet...:)
"A very piteous thing it was to see such a quantity of dead bodies, and such an outpouring of blood - that is, if they had not been enemies of the Christian faith."

- Jean Pierre Sarrasin, "The Memoirs of the Lord of Joinville"
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Re: One World Ravenloft

Post by Chaot »

Right. My Ravenloft is a real world as well. How do you represent this to your players though?

One way is to give them a CIA fact book https://www.cia.gov/library/publication ... d-factbook of domains. I don't go that far but I do give the players something like this.

Image

Let's them know where they are from and what they can do. No big timeline or anything because there are certain things I hold true about Ravenloft.

1. It's all humans, baby. you introduce demi-humans and you take away from the human condition. Take away from the human condition and things become slightly less scary.

2. Forget about the D&D worlds. When Soth shows up in my game he will have zero relations with Dragonlance. Look at the core of the character and enhance that. When someone recognizes it as being from an outside source it will take them out of the game. Be ruthless in your editing.

3. Don't worry about domain history. The domain may have existed before it's current Lord. The domain may have sprung from it's current Lord's personal situation. It doesn't matter. For all intents and purposes the domain has always been there. If it is old it has it's own history. If it is new then it has rewritten history and those both within and in other domains have memories of the new domain always being there.

4. The Mists will mess you up sometimes. People from the domains know this and that is why small traders are so successful. You get lost in the Mists and you might end up somewhere else. It's common knowledge. You really want to know how to travel in the Mists, talk to a Vistani. Remember though, Vistani will rob you as soon as look at you.

5. Remember there are things out there who want to kill you. Men who walk in wolves' skins, blood drinkers, all manner of the kindly ones. Trust your family and friends and be aware of glamours.

I'm in no way a Ravenloft purest and I believe that making Ravenloft be it's own thing rather than a weekend in hell is the loftiest of goals. In these things I think our goals align. I believe the end to that goal is to cut out the D&D tropisms and enjoy the rest of the setting.
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Re: One World Ravenloft

Post by Five »

Chaot:

Hm.

I really do like the simplicity of it, gotta say. Reminds of old school Dungeons and Dragons (where DMs for the most part filled in the blanks, not the developers), and as such encourages DMs and players to really take Ravenloft and make it their own. A sort of template Ravenloft. Only fitting, giving the nature of this game (ttrpg) as well as that of personal fear/horror...

Brilliantly simple.
"A very piteous thing it was to see such a quantity of dead bodies, and such an outpouring of blood - that is, if they had not been enemies of the Christian faith."

- Jean Pierre Sarrasin, "The Memoirs of the Lord of Joinville"
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